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Old 08-17-10, 10:45 AM   #1
Abbeysdad
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Default Hydrofoil ?

First let me say I don't have a problem getting up on plane, but I do need to be at about 4000rpm / 28mph or there abouts. I'm interested in a hydrofoil as the hydrofoil manufacturers claim on plane at speeds down to 10mph and improved fuel economy - some with no reduction in top end speed.
In looking at many different ones, Cobra Marine seems to have one of the best. It can be had in aluminum or stainless (rather than plastic) and bolts from beneath the cavitation plate rather than the plastic ones that bolt on top.

http://www.cabelas.com/link-12/produ...:referralID=NA

Thoughts?

(Could be real nice to be up on plane at half throttle or less.)
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Old 08-17-10, 11:11 AM   #2
walkeraviator
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i dot think it effects how much power you need to get up on teh plane, but they do allow you to slow down and stay on teh plane at much slower speeds... and i believe they allow you draft a few inches shallower when on plane....

but you may need someone who is more an expert than i to confirm that...
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Old 08-17-10, 11:20 PM   #3
lilmule
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They do plane slower and that somewhat depends on the actual boat and motor combo its placed on,a hefty ranger 373,150 hp about 19-21 mph,a lighter boat with a same maybe 17,it does however make the rear higher and go shallow easier and when rough also helps keep the noose from flying up so fast.Often however it will also cause a tad bit of porposing,cure is trim or gas.The benefits far outweigh any minus gained.
It also will let one plane in shallower water due to nose not going as high and rear lifting.
But 10 mph is unrealistic,also a stepped pad is necessary in order to go fairly slow as to get a modern bb on full pad is over 50 mph nowdays.
What you desire 28 mph is realistic many boats would do that as is,it will however make it easier to do it.
When at faster speeds its totally out of the water or riding on top at times,and does not alter top end significantly,I use one on a boat that tops 80 easily,for mostly shallow operation being able to get in and out of 2 ft deep bays,and actually run in them at times.
Doing so however does place the eq at risk.in particular if one does not know whats in it.
If I had to could get on plane in as lil as 1 1/2 ft of water,with a 2002 allison,20 ft boat,200 hp,hydraulic jp needed for that.

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Old 08-18-10, 02:54 PM   #4
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http://www.cobramarine.com/

Disclaimer: I have absolutely no affiliation with these folks.
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Old 08-19-10, 11:32 AM   #5
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I was thinking about this one, StingRay™ XPII Hydrofoil. Read the reviews.

http://www.basspro.com/webapp/wcs/st..._SearchResults
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Old 08-19-10, 03:45 PM   #6
lilmule
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Ive owned several different brands including a bobs metal one,to me the plastic bends a tad or gives and gets up quicker just about any of them will do,but all have some hype with excessively slow speed obtained that inst a real factor for most,lab conditions etc.
They all help to some degree,assist with slower operation,getting on plane easier and to some degree raising the stern and keeping the bow down,for what they cost its an inexpensive gain in handling,with a possible fuel savings at lower rpm ranges.
No gain at all of much of any kind at speed due to its out of the water,other than in rough water handling,in that respect it beats without hands down,keeping the nose from digging and the stern up instead of the nose when used in conjunction of the gas applied,and proper trim,more neutral than up.Length of boat somewhat applies for that as well.A 20-22 ft boat any beam almost can run in 2 1/2 fters to 3 fters so eq and with seat time,on plane.
It is however a tool and like any tool needs to be learned usage,for applications possibly it wasnt designed for yet works.
Even if you never use it for operation in hefty stuff the low end benefits far outweigh any disadvantages if any,I havnt found any so far but only been using them for about 15 years.
On everything from a 15 ft skeeter 17 ft phantom,to a 1600 pd ranger 19 1/2 ft to a 20 ft glassport ,a 22 ft jaguar 1.800 lbs and a 20 ft allison weighing but tad over 1000.
The ranger having a popup problem it solved it.

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Old 09-20-10, 12:45 PM   #7
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Update****

Okay...I put one of these things on my boat....and...it works!
Really can't find anything really bad to say about it...other than I had to drill holes in my cavitation plate.

1. Boat get's up on plane soon as you gas it.
2. Handles rough water MUCH better. Difference was very substantial.
3. Seemed to reduce prop blowout...not eliminate it, still broke loose a little.
4. Makes this really obnoxious rooser tail, wife says it looks cool....hmmm.
5. Can stay on plane at stupid slow speeds. This feels so...wierd.
6. Did not really gain any speed. Which is cool, didn't want that anyway.


Bottom line...I like it. Just the smoother ride makes it a keeper for me. This saturday was the first time I'd crossed the potomac in a long time, maybe ever, that I never felt the need to hold on to my testicles with one hand. And there was some rough water Saturday too! My testicles...pain free all day.

Bought it off a guy on craigslist for next to nothing.

Am anxious to try it with my other prop. that will really tell the tail.

To be continued...
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Old 09-20-10, 03:44 PM   #8
Abbeysdad
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so bobby, what kind is it? plastic or metal?
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Old 09-21-10, 07:58 AM   #9
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I got the Stingray. It's plastic.
Cant wait to try it with my other prop.
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Old 09-22-10, 09:23 PM   #10
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They arnt ment as a speed gain merely a handling enhancement,like easier to plane shallower to plane less bow rise,and better handling in rough water,and once up basically out of the water.
The prop issue blowout is unrelated its the prop,something with more grip or added grip,it will as an added benefit at slow speed increase mpg gas usage,you will find it pops up with much less rpms and not pointed at the sky.
The rough water ride alone is worth it let alone the easy planing.
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Old 09-22-10, 09:47 PM   #11
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I think I'm sold...gonna set my sites on this one in black stainless steel:
http://www.cabelas.com/link-12/produ...:referralID=NA
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Old 09-23-10, 04:29 PM   #12
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Steel ones normally dont bend or flex as much therefore dont work quite as good as a plastic one,they do work still just not as good that plastic will flex,the steel one wont.
Ive owned a bobs metal one and didnt like it near as much as the plastic ones planing time was a tad slower,maybe if it had down turned outside wings to create more lift most steel ones are rather plain.
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Old 09-23-10, 04:58 PM   #13
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By the same token, I've read countless reviews of the plastic bolt on top hydrofoils ending up in the bottom of the lake. The hydrofoils job is to redirect the water flow and force the rear up - the flex of the bending material does nothing to facilitate this. The plastic ones may still work in spite of the flex, but not because of it.
If you look at the history, Cobra Marine began making these hydrofoils for racing boats since the mid 80's - who in racing would bolt on a piece of plastic ?
I also like the idea that unlike the plastic jobs, the plate mounts on the underside of the cavitation plate providing a much stronger backing against the forces involved.
But in thinking of it more, I think the aluminum would be more cost effective.
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Old 09-24-10, 08:55 PM   #14
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Abbey, I can guarantee you that if you create the forces required to rip a plastic hydrofoil off of your cavitation plate, you will be glad you had plastic. Without it, your outboard is going to absorb it all.

There are some times you want a sacrificial component.
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Old 09-24-10, 10:07 PM   #15
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Depends on what you're doing with your boat, but for me they serve no useful purpose. These things may be a benifit to get and keep an underpowered boat on plane or the alum. boat guys that troll, or possibly benificial if towing a skier or tuber, but I can't see the need on a bass boat that jumps on plane and runs WOT most of the time. Personally I don't have any interest in the ability to run on plane SLOWER, if I'm on plane I'm headed somewhere and up and gone.
OH - yeah the Potomac (main river) was rough on Sat. Ran from Mattawoman to Aquia and those 3 footers did make for an exciting ride and the boys are tender, but still functioning (LOL)
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Old 09-24-10, 11:21 PM   #16
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I like mine for when I'm not wanting to run like a bat out of hell, but just to cruise at 20 mph, taking in the sights.....it really improves your gas mileage at that speed vs running WOT.
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Old 09-24-10, 11:23 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nofearengineer View Post
Abbey, I can guarantee you that if you create the forces required to rip a plastic hydrofoil off of your cavitation plate, you will be glad you had plastic. Without it, your outboard is going to absorb it all. There are some times you want a sacrificial component.
Nofear, I think you missed the point. I researched this pretty closely. The plastic jobs bolt onto the top of the cavitation plate so all force is against the 4 or 6 nuts that hold it on. The plastic gives way around the bolt holes and it's gone. If you have one of these, consider larger washers beneath the bolts.
There's another model that just clamps on, but reviews indicate they rarely hold.

The one I'm looking at mounts on the underside of the cavitation plate giving it the support of the cavitation plate.

In addition to fishing, I like boating too and touring around the lake - the idea of having her on plane at slower speeds appeals to me as over time, this could save a lot of gas. I've also heard the improve handling and stability in rough waters - another appealing idea.
It's not always about WOT, at least for me.
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Old 09-25-10, 04:30 AM   #18
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Quote:
I like mine for when I'm not wanting to run like a bat out of hell
NOT wanting to run like a BOOH? Sacrilege, pure sacrilege. LOL. Really I get that, but it's not me. As I said it's about what YOU want to do. Me, I want to be the bat.
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Old 09-25-10, 08:24 AM   #19
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Ive used both plastic and steel for a lil over 20 years now have never broken either,they are however due to that design a more or less break away if one hits something like a stump,sacrificing it over a lower unit or part thereof.The steel one does not give even a minor bump with no damage you can tell the difference between steel and plastic.
Both have their pros and cons but up to each and every owner,if your happy thats what counts.
As for running like a bat out of ell all it does is get one a quicker start and add handling in rough water or shallow water capability not actual speed.,in a few cases top end may even decrease 1/2 mph or so in others a gain of about the same.
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Old 09-25-10, 08:29 PM   #20
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If you hit a stump, that hydrofoil is the least of your worries.
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Old 09-29-10, 04:05 PM   #21
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Dude I'm diggin' my plastic one. And my boat is absolutley NOT underpowered! With my 22 degree 4 blade prop the thing is stupid fast!

I wanted it to improved planing but mainly...because I fish the potomac and it's tough out there with an 18 foot boat, I wanted to smooth out the ride in that rough water.

Two words....MISSION ACCOMPLISHED!
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