Crankin' reels

[Wishing2BFishing]

I have two reels that I use for crankin'. Both reels are Chronarchs, one is a Chronarch MG and the other is just a plain old Chronarch. Anyway, one of the guys in my bassin' club mentioned that I should get a reel with a slower retrieve. He seems to think that my Chronarchs take up the line too fast for crankin'.

So, Gentleman, any thoughts on this subject?

[fishin' fool]

I totally agree. All of my cranking reels are are slower than a 6 gear ratio. Two of them are 5:1:1, and one is 4:1:1. The slower gears help me fish cranks through thick cover with out getting hung up as much. But remember, some cranks don't swim right if they are fished to slow.

[lunker-lander]

If you're like me, you like a bit faster reel for crankin'. Anywhere from 5.3:1 to 6.2:1; any higher will overcrank, and ruin the baits action.

Now, if you're cranking slower, wider-wobbling, deeper-diving baits, you should go slower. Somewhere in the range of 5.7:1 or less.

-Lunk-

P.S. - Remember, it's easier to crank slower with a fast reel than to crank faster with a slow reel.

[Fish2win]

Everyone has a natural cadence of retrieve speed. I use a 5.1 to 1 reel for crankin. It works great for me. I bought a 3.8 to 1 crank bait reel. I have never caught a fish on a crankbait with that reel. You may do best with a 6.1 or a 3.8 to 1. I believe it is different with everyone.
If your natural cadence works best with a 5.1 to 1 then going to a faster or slower reel will make it hard for you to judge what you are actually doing. Speeding up or slowing down a set ratio that you are accustomed to will put you more in touch with the lure.

Fish2win

[zooker]

rule of thumb
slower for hard baits faster for soft baits..

i can change my retrive speed at will and have no problem doing it..if i catch a fish at a certain "cadence" i can change reels -differant gearing-and keep up the same speed..

zooker

[3dkicker]

Trick would be to remove 1/4 of the line from the spool of a higher speed reel. You pick up less line per turn and hence a slower speed.

[Rebbasser]

For smaller baits and lipless it really doesn't matter. However, with big, deep cranks like a DD-22 it makes a huge difference. If I throw a DD-22 on a 6.3:1 reel I'm good for about 5 casts. I use a BPS David Fritts reel with a 4.7:1 GR and can throw it all day.

[jooleyen]

This is what I would choose :

Lipless/Shallow runners - 6.4:1... in the summertime when an ultra fast retrieve works well for me with lipless crankbaits, a 7.1:1.

Deep - 6.4:1

Deep(dd-22 or deeper) - 5/4:1 reels will crank without wearing your wrist too much.

Medium - 6.4:1

-In conclusion, I guess I like fast reels as Lunker-Lander does.

[Cranebird]

Your friend is wrong.

A Fritts 4.7:1 gear ratio reel will pull just as much line per turn of the handle as your Shimano Chronarchs will. In fact exactly the same .

Who ever thought of this gear ratio theory is a worse liar than Elliot Spitzer ever thought of being.

To determine how fast the reel is is determined by the spool width and spool height and line diameter as well as the gear ratio all combined.You cannot determine the speed by any one single component of this list.

If you already have the chronachs you are not going to like the new cranking reel that you buy over your chronarchs.

That is about as point blank as I can get to the truth of the subject. I am just trying to save you some extra money if your strapped for cash like most of us are or if you got go spend it and let me know I am wrong if I am wrong.Ivan

[CarpMan]

C-Bird Fly Off LOL

[BigBassin144]

For my smaller cranks like XCalibur Wakebait and no deeper than a Bandit 100 or DT4 I use a 6.0:1 Shimano Symetre. (I know, I know, spinning gear). As for deeper cranks, I'll use a slower 5.4-5.7:1. As for large really deep crank like the Bandit 700 or DD22, I Use no faster than a 5.2:1.


BB

[lunker-lander]

Summed-up well....

-Lunk-

[Rebbasser]

Dang, Ivan-who peed in your Post Tosties?

[Bob60]

Since crankin is my weakness my opinion my be of little use,but here goes. I have 3 KVD's 6.2:1, 1 KVD 5.2:1, 2 David Fritts 4.7:1. I just plain had a hard time slow crankin with those 6.2's. Having the 2 David Fritts reels just help me mentally slow down when crankin. Does that make sense to anyone?

[zooker]

Originally Posted by Bob60

Having the 2 David Fritts reels just help me mentally slow down when crankin. Does that make sense to anyone?

no bob your right.. cranking is about 35% about speed and 55% contact the other 10% is struture based.. the speed has to be pretty close to right on. most cranking is done not to make the bait look scared. but to look preoccupied. remember your lure looks like a bait fish if that bait fish is running helter skelter all over the place. bass wont touch it unless they are busting shad at the surface. if a bait is just "feeding" along and looks to be an easy meal then bass will take the easy meal well before the fast and furious high speed baits..

though ivan gets bent out of shape about how much line is retrived per handle turn. this is utter nonsense and just plain bs. a slower geared reel has greater line holding capacity, belive it or not. a quatum mag gear 5.1 gearing holds 140 yards of 12 pound ande mono..a quatum pt 6.3 geared reel holds 110 yards of the same line...a quatum tour edition 7.1 geared reel holds 85 YARDS of the same line.. i KNOW this for a FACT as i have measured it with a laser range finder. all reels mentioned were filled perfectly..
now on an average long cast i normally can get an average crank bait out about 50 yards. deep diving and lipless 60-75 yards depending on the bait..at these distances any reel only retrives about 1/2 what the line retrive rate is per handle turn..

sorry ivan your whining about line return rate is baseless and bull..

nuff said


zooker

[Cranebird]

Originally Posted by Cranebird

To determine how fast the reel is is determined by the spool width and spool height and line diameter as well as the gear ratio all combined.You cannot determine the speed by any one single component of this list.

Zooker,You are fooling yourself if you do not think this is what is involved in the reels actual speed.You need to stop with the paradigm way of thinking and learn something about the new reel designs.

Rebbasser, the reel ads have been pissing in my froot loops for a while now and I am sick and tired of the misleading information provided for us customers. I love the Bass pro shop catalogs for they provide the " per turn retreive rate in their ads. People need to pay attention to that and not get caught up in the gear ratios gimmick bull.

Bob, It does make sense to think that because the spool is turning 4.7 times per 1 complete turn of the handle compared to the 5 turns or 6.2 turns per 1 complete turn of the handle as far as numbers go.

In actuality 4.7 is near 5 anyway and another 1.2 turn of spool line to get to a 6.2:1 ratio measures very little line compared to what the the numbers might suggest because the spools are relatively so small in diameter therefore you are only gaining a small amount of line . If the spool sizes were alot larger in size then the gear ratios would have a greater effect on the reels speed.

3D Kicker is dead on his posting comment about spooling 3/4 of a spool to slow the reels speed down. The spool height is part of the equation. the taller the spool the faster the line retrieve, the lower the height the slower the line retreive.

3D, you move to the front of the class.

Next time I will refuse to comment on real reel posts. I hope one person learns the truth from this post so we can break the Paradigm or old way of thinking. You younger people are being taken to the cleaners with thinking you need different gear ratios when the fact is most different gear ratios will pull the same reel speeds. Thank you all for letting my frustrations out and thank you Zooker for disagreeing with me.I feel more confident in knowing everything is still normal . C-Bird Feathers ruffled.

[Cranebird]

I was thinking Zooker might be right for a change so I am deciding to open this back up for further review since no one is posting on it anyways.

Lets say the maximum spool height of line on a reel is 1 1/8 " tall when measuring it spooled up.For this particular reel the gear ratio is 6.2:1 since people like to use gear ratios in their threads.

I use pi system to know how many inches is in that 1 1/8 "diameter. 3.14x 1.25 = 3.925"

Lets say the spool width is wide enough to sustain the required amount of line to do a gear ratio test.

I know the reels gear ratio is 6.2:1 but I do not know the line diameter at this time so we will run with the pi system formula for now.

3.925 x 6.2 = 24.335" of line. The 6.2 is 6.2 revoulutions per 1 complete turn of the handle or 6.2:1 gear ratio.

Now we know this we can formulate the rest of the gear ratios to determine how much the gear ratios effect the reel speed if we were able to change out the gears in this particular reel.

7:1 gear ratio = 27.475"
6.3:1 gear ratio = 24.335"
5.8:1 gear ratio = 22.765"
5.4:1 gear ratio = 21.195"
5.3:1 gear ratio = 20.802"
5:1 gear ratio = 19.625"
4.7 gear ratio = 18.447"
4:1 gear ratio = 17.270"

As you can see the gear ratio does in fact change the line recovery rate using this pi formula. We gained 10.205" of more line at a 7:1 gear ratio from a 4.4:1 gear ratio.

So is it safe to say the higher gear ratios will always be alot faster than a slower gear ratio when chosing a new reel ?

The answer is no. as mentioned before gear ratio is part of the 4 things that regulate the line recovery speed.

1. gear ratio
2. spool height
3. spool width
4. line diameter

Not all spool designs are the same therefore you cannot judge the speed by the gear ratio alone.

1. gear ratio - determines how many revolutions per turn of the handle.
2. spool height- a part of what determines at what rate the line speed is acheived at its maximum speed.
3.spool width-helps determine the sustained speed of the line recovery, the wider the spool the more wraps of line at that rate of speed.
4. line diameter- determines what rate of retreive by changin the height as the rate of line on the spool changes.

* you need to use the line recovery provided in the bass pro catalog to choose a special purpose rate of speed lure presentation. The thing they don't tell you is the line diameter being used in the results. Line diameter has an effect on the speed recovery as well but look at the line recovery they publish in their ads to get an idea of the many different spool designs being used.It just might be of more help to you when trying to choose a special purpose reel. C-Bird.

[Wishing2BFishing]

"Remember, it's easier to crank slower with a fast reel than to crank faster with a slow reel"

Good point . . .

[Jackl]

WISHING,
Here is a couple tips that might save you money;
Install a BPS Pro Hawg Handler ($10.00) which is longer than the factory handle. This longer throw will slow down your cranking speed and may be enough. If not, you could remove 1/3 to 1/2 of your line as previously advised by 3DKICKER, which along with the longer handle may slow your reel down enough to suit you.
Another trick is to contact Joe Arnold at Armadillo Rod and Reel Repair (903-383-7891 or www.armadillorodandreelrepair.com ) and have a 3:8 to 1 or a 5 to 1 ratio main gear installed for around $30.00. Then if you did not like the lower ratio, you could change the gear ratio back, put the shorter handle back on and re-spool more line back on the reel, and have not spent a couple hundred dollars on a new reel which you do not like. (And someone with a Shimano reel may buy the lower gear set from you)
I recently had Joe convert one of my Curados to 3:8 ratio for cranking swim baits. I just got back from Lake Fork for the maiden run of the new ratio. It worked great on swimbaits, crankbaits and slow rolling large bladed spinnerbaits (#5 & #6 Colorado blades) without wearing my arm
out. I am thinking of converting another Curado to 5 to 1 ratio for smaller crankbaits and spinnerbaits.
I hope this gives you some alternatives methods to try without the price of a new reel, which you may not like.

JackL

[Wishing2BFishing]

So there is no consensus on this subject?

Some members, such as Cranebird, feel (quite strongly), that there isn't much of a difference in how much faster/slower the lure travels with a higher/lesser gear ratio. Other members, such as Lunkerlander, recommend slowing down on the retrieve if one is using a higher gear ratio reel. And others, have gone as far as to modify some of their existing reels to achieve a slow cadence retrieve.

Now I am more confused than ever. I generally do well throwin' cranks with my Chronarchs. However, there are times when I can't get bit even with my "go-to" DT-6. I wonder if that is because the fish just don't want cranks (I usually switch up to plastics at that point), or if I used a different/slower reel, I would get bit again with the cranks. Anyone try the Chronarch BPV version? I believe it has a reduced gear ratio? Would it make sense to invest in one of these reels for crankin' (I always thought the lesser gear ratio reels were for getting a good hookset in pads and other garbage)?

P.S. I didn't realize that there would be so many opinions on this subject.

[Cranebird]

You said you can catch fish with your chronarchs.I beleive that because I use a Shimano metaniumXT with the DT6 cranks and bandit 100's and caught a ton of fish .The Mentanium XT is the japanese version of the Chronarchs that you buy here in the USA.

Now on the days they don't catch fishis your problem.It is where you have to figure out is it the crankbait presentation, wrong area, wrong speed, wrong color, wasn't holding your tongue right. lmao......

By all means buy another reel if you like and better yet sell me your chronarchs. C-Bird

[zooker]

Originally Posted by Cranebird

Now on the days they don't catch fishis your problem.It is where you have to figure out is it the crankbait presentation, wrong area, wrong speed,

tht is the most honest statement you have ever said ivan..

btw just how much crankin do you do??

zooker

[Cranebird]

More than I like to admit. For what its worth I like a line recovery ratio of 18"- 21 " That is not fast by any means .I selected my reel selection towards the slower line retreive with a few faster reels for specific lure selections. One thing you can do is move your rod tip to take up line slack or keep up with a fish or present the lure at a quicker alternating speeds.

I cannot stress enough that you need to look at the line recovery rate before choosing a reel

Do not judge the line recovery rate by the reels gear ratio. You people are only reading what you want to hear.

Zooker come on home again and we'll throw crankbaits.I got some super spots GPS marked on quite a few different lakes now.

[Bob Smith]

I have been accused of "worming" my diving crankbaits more than once. I often simply use my rod and drag the bait along the bottom and use the reel to pick up slack. It's great for feeling the bottom, and forces you to use a stop and go retrieve. REgardless of the gear ratio, line size and line capacity, if I am throwing a diving crankbait I very rarely "burn" my retrieve. In fact, with my lipless baits I seldom go faster than a "moderate" retrieve regardless of reel.

[bothomas]

just found this post...... I was thinking about buying a new reel..... can any of you guys give me any advice on which gear ratio to buy???