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Old 05-06-10, 07:14 PM   #1
Bassboss
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Default Dedoing a spinning rod grip, and reel seat?

All righty fellas, I know there's a few rod builders on here, and I PMed waffle about it, but my question changed a bit since than?

So I'm thinking about changing the grip from the mushy EVA I have on there now, to some grade AAAA cork (I'll use cork rings, at 2.50 for 100). The reel seat I would prolly use is an Pacific Bay MINIMA Ultra-Lite unless some one can suggest a more comfortable one, WITH blank contact!?

I've gotta few questions though......

I heard from a rod builder (Rick from RK custom rods), that I can get the grip and reel seat off buy placing it them in boiling water, the glue will liquefy and I can just slid it off. So once I get that off I would just put the reel seat on (by adding a bit of glue to it and letting it sit). Anyone tried this, and how does it work, and is there a better method?

Than I would start adding the cork with a little bit of glue between each one and in the hole. Once I put all of that on (with a split grip) I would sand it to shape along with the excess glue, correct?

Am I headed in the write direction guys? What about the size diameter reel reel seat and cork rings would I need? And would I need anything else other than the Cork rings, reel seat, and glue? Some kinda of cork sealant maybe?

Thanks for any and all help guys!!!

edit: Grr.... I knew something looked funny about the title... REdoing a spinning rod grip, and reel seat?
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Old 05-06-10, 07:52 PM   #2
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First of all, you won't be getting premium grade cork for 100 rings for $2.50. Top of the line cork rings top out around $1.00 per 1/2 thick ring. The bad thing is wineries are paying top dollar for the best cork, so good cork is becoming harder and harder to find.

The rod builder you talked to made this sound a lot easier than it is. I don't know how many of the guys that build rods on here actually make their own handles with cork rings, but I have.

If you're serious about doing this, you'll need a few tools.

1. For one, "glue" ain't gonna cut it. You'll need some epoxy. Any two part 30 minute epoxy will work. I use Devcon 2 ton epoxy.
2. You'll need something to ream the center holes of the rings with - a cork reamer works nicely, but they are pricey. The good ones will run you $20-25 each, and there's like 5 different sizes. A round file works ok, but it's very hard to get the holes centered.
3. You'll need a cork clamp as well if you use cork rings. they have to be compressed while the epoxy dried.
4. Finally, you'll need a way to turn the cork. A lathe and some different grits of sandpaper work nicely.

I can't help you with removing the EVA, but I can with building the new handle.

The more parts you have to the handle with bare blank in between, the longer it takes to do. Redoing a handle is tricky because all you're parts have to go on from the back, where the blank is the biggest around.

Something with a solid reel seat and full grip is going to be the easiest and quickest. I've heard the split reel seats are difficult to work with, and I know from experience that a split grip handle can be a pain, and also take a while.

If you use a normal reel seat, you'll also need some graphite arbors (and you may still need one with the Minima reel seat. You'll also need some winding checks for that seat.

I'll run over everything quickly.

First, ream all your cork rings to the right sizes. This is going to be tough since they all have to fit over the butt of the rod. so the upper ones are going to be looser. Once you get them, and you reel seat positioned how you want them, try and turn all the cork rings to where they are the most even with the rest of them. take a permanent marker and draw a line down the handle then number each ring from the top starting at 1 (make sure you're ones don't look like 7's and 3's like 8's cause it can and will get confusing if they do, lol).

Now, mix your epoxy and have some rubbing alcohol or lacquer thinner nearby (I think lacquer thinner works better). Now you'll have to work quickly. Put your first rings on (for the foregrip if you're making one). Then some epoxy, then the next ring lining up the permanent marker lines, more epoxy, ring, etc. you get the idea.

If you're not going a foregrip, add a winding check and the reel seat. (this is only for a normal full reel seat (and a size 16 should work fine)) Then put your graphite arbors (which I'd order a few extras of. they have a tendency to break when reaming them) on and put the reel seat over them.you'll want to make sure both end of the reel seat are good and filled with epoxy (there should be directions with it).

Then proceed to add cork rings and epoxy for the rear grip. if you're doing a split grip, you have to do the top section with the reel seat first, clamp it, and let it dry, then do the rear grip later. If not, continue to the end of the rod. Clamp it in the cork clamp and use a lacquer thinner soaked paper towel to clean off the excess epoxy.

Once it's all dry, it's time to sand. I guess you could do it by hand, but I can't guarantee it will be even. So spin it on the lathe and start with a coarser grit sandpaper, like 80 to get most of the cork off down to where you want it. Then switch to 120 and smooth it out a bit. then finish off with like 180 grit. epoxy on a butt cap, and there you go. a new handle.

That said, I'd go with a premade handle to simplify things.

BB
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Old 05-06-10, 08:29 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by BigBassin144 View Post
First of all, you won't be getting premium grade cork for 100 rings for $2.50. Top of the line cork rings top out around $1.00 per 1/2 thick ring. The bad thing is wineries are paying top dollar for the best cork, so good cork is becoming harder and harder to find.

The rod builder you talked to made this sound a lot easier than it is. I don't know how many of the guys that build rods on here actually make their own handles with cork rings, but I have.

If you're serious about doing this, you'll need a few tools.

1. For one, "glue" ain't gonna cut it. You'll need some epoxy. Any two part 30 minute epoxy will work. I use Devcon 2 ton epoxy.
2. You'll need something to ream the center holes of the rings with - a cork reamer works nicely, but they are pricey. The good ones will run you $20-25 each, and there's like 5 different sizes. A round file works ok, but it's very hard to get the holes centered.
3. You'll need a cork clamp as well if you use cork rings. they have to be compressed while the epoxy dried.
4. Finally, you'll need a way to turn the cork. A lathe and some different grits of sandpaper work nicely.

I can't help you with removing the EVA, but I can with building the new handle.

The more parts you have to the handle with bare blank in between, the longer it takes to do. Redoing a handle is tricky because all you're parts have to go on from the back, where the blank is the biggest around.

Something with a solid reel seat and full grip is going to be the easiest and quickest. I've heard the split reel seats are difficult to work with, and I know from experience that a split grip handle can be a pain, and also take a while.

If you use a normal reel seat, you'll also need some graphite arbors (and you may still need one with the Minima reel seat. You'll also need some winding checks for that seat.

I'll run over everything quickly.

First, ream all your cork rings to the right sizes. This is going to be tough since they all have to fit over the butt of the rod. so the upper ones are going to be looser. Once you get them, and you reel seat positioned how you want them, try and turn all the cork rings to where they are the most even with the rest of them. take a permanent marker and draw a line down the handle then number each ring from the top starting at 1 (make sure you're ones don't look like 7's and 3's like 8's cause it can and will get confusing if they do, lol).

Now, mix your epoxy and have some rubbing alcohol or lacquer thinner nearby (I think lacquer thinner works better). Now you'll have to work quickly. Put your first rings on (for the foregrip if you're making one). Then some epoxy, then the next ring lining up the permanent marker lines, more epoxy, ring, etc. you get the idea.

If you're not going a foregrip, add a winding check and the reel seat. (this is only for a normal full reel seat (and a size 16 should work fine)) Then put your graphite arbors (which I'd order a few extras of. they have a tendency to break when reaming them) on and put the reel seat over them.you'll want to make sure both end of the reel seat are good and filled with epoxy (there should be directions with it).

Then proceed to add cork rings and epoxy for the rear grip. if you're doing a split grip, you have to do the top section with the reel seat first, clamp it, and let it dry, then do the rear grip later. If not, continue to the end of the rod. Clamp it in the cork clamp and use a lacquer thinner soaked paper towel to clean off the excess epoxy.

Once it's all dry, it's time to sand. I guess you could do it by hand, but I can't guarantee it will be even. So spin it on the lathe and start with a coarser grit sandpaper, like 80 to get most of the cork off down to where you want it. Then switch to 120 and smooth it out a bit. then finish off with like 180 grit. epoxy on a butt cap, and there you go. a new handle.

That said, I'd go with a premade handle to simplify things.

BB
Jeeze, thanks biggins! I think you're right about the premade handle too! Sounds pretty damned complicated! And sounds like it could get pricey! I wonder if I could take some 80 grit sand paper and glue it to a dowel rather than getting a ream. And a "C" clap rather than the cork holder thing you where talking about... wuduya think?
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Old 05-06-10, 09:12 PM   #4
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The thing about the reamer is it need to be tapered at least slightly. It need to fit in the center hole - normally 1/8"

As for the c-clamp, probably not. Here's a picture of a cork clamp. The blank goes through a hole at one and it tightens, compressing the cork. Usually with wing nuts. You can probably build one of these.

(in fact, this is actually a home made one.)

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Old 05-06-10, 09:21 PM   #5
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Part of the problem you're gonna have using cork is reaming it out big enough to fit over the butt of the rod. It's going to have to be so big that once you get it where you want it you're gonna have to shim your grip. Grips generally go on from the tip so that they fit snug. I shape my own grips, it is fun and you get exactly what you want. I don't think it would be easy to do without the proper tools though.

I'm not trying to dissuade you but I think this is going to be a pretty tough job to tackle and get results you are going to be happy with. I've never tried to do what you're talking about but I do know how to build a rod and this isn't something I would want to tackle. If I were you and you are dead set on trying this, don't use cork. Buy a good firm eva and try to work it on over the butt. Eva stretches where cork splits.
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Old 05-06-10, 09:42 PM   #6
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Can't get the cork clamp off when building a handle from the back on a rod with guides, unless the blank hole in the front member is cut to a U instead of an O.

Taking off the old reel seat, you'll probably find it was shimmed with cardboard.
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Old 05-06-10, 10:18 PM   #7
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Can't get the cork clamp off when building a handle from the back on a rod with guides, unless the blank hole in the front member is cut to a U instead of an O.

I completely forgot out this. You are 100% correct. I had to do this when building my split grip.

Sammy, in all honesty, I would just buy a premade handle or not worry about it. (maybe save the money and buy a lawn mower )

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Old 05-07-10, 12:05 AM   #8
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I recently removed a reel seat. It had some cardboard spacers and a lot of empty space between it and the blank. I used a Dremmel with a cutting wheel to get through it and then peeled it off. if you do it this way be VERY CAREFUL not to cut into the blank or you will ruin the whole thing. Then I used a tiny screwdriver and a razor and chipped the rest of the epoxy off the blank. The cork comes off just by using the screwdriver and peeling. it off.
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Old 05-07-10, 05:42 PM   #9
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YIKES!

This sounds really hard! And here I thought this was gonna be a piece of cake!! I think the eva idea is a good one, and it'll most definitely simply things. Question though:

Is the top part of the split grip called a fore grip as well? And is the grip below that called a rear grip?
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Old 05-07-10, 05:53 PM   #10
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The top of a split grip is called the rear grip. The foregrip is above the reel seat.
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Old 05-07-10, 06:35 PM   #11
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Was this a straight grip to a split grip?
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Old 05-08-10, 07:44 AM   #12
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The top of a split grip is called the rear grip. The foregrip is above the reel seat.
that's what I thought.. my only reason for asking is becuase I don't see a bottom grip for a split grip online anywhere?! So what's the bottom part?

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Was this a straight grip to a split grip?
No, split grip, to better split grip.
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Old 05-08-10, 07:51 AM   #13
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that's what I thought.. my only reason for asking is becuase I don't see a bottom grip for a split grip online anywhere?! So what's the bottom part?

The bottom part is called the fighting butt. That would be the one easy part of this. You can buy the fighting butt pre-made and glue it on your blank after you get the rear grip and seat assembled. Look about halfway down the link and you will find some fighting butts. Most fighting butts sold are cork though.

http://www.mudhole.com/Shop-Our-Cata...Fighting-Butts
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Old 05-08-10, 08:06 AM   #14
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The bottom part is called the fighting butt. That would be the one easy part of this. You can buy the fighting butt pre-made and glue it on your blank after you get the rear grip and seat assembled. Look about halfway down the link and you will find some fighting butts. Most fighting butts sold are cork though.

http://www.mudhole.com/Shop-Our-Cata...Fighting-Butts
Ah! Thanks you very much Joe!
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Old 05-08-10, 11:34 AM   #15
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Ah! Thanks you very much Joe!
No problem Boss, good luck!
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Old 05-08-10, 12:25 PM   #16
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Hey Sammy, I just though of something else that might work for you. You can buy the grip material that is on the BPS Carbonlite rods. It is a heat shrink material so it should have a large enough i.d. to fit over the butt of your rod and then heat it up to snug it down. I've never used it but have been wanting to try it out. I do know that it is super firm. Might be worth looking into.

http://www.mudhole.com/Shop-Our-Cata...er-Shrink-Tube

Give Todd or Bob at Mudhole a call or if you have a rod building supply shop close to you ask them about it.
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Old 05-08-10, 02:36 PM   #17
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By god someone needs to try that shrink tubing,haha!
Thats actually gonna be your easiest route,using the shrink x wrap tubing..Stripping off EVA aint fun...Ive heard of the boiling method,but I dont have a pot that big..lol
Even when you chew,and shave off most the foam,you still have to sand,sand,sand.
A heat gun on LOW helps loosen the epoxy and you can use a dull instrument to scrape it off..Then a high grit sandpaper,then steel wool (my way)Its just trail and error on what works best...If you use a heat gun,work it fast and rotate the blank as you run it up and down.
If your just replacing the grips,then it shouldnt be to hard a task....Just go slow and be patient.

Or Joe will do it for $150!!..hahahaha!
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Old 05-08-10, 03:11 PM   #18
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Or Joe will do it for $150!!..hahahaha!
Haha, not a chance!!
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Old 05-08-10, 04:12 PM   #19
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Hey Sammy, I just though of something else that might work for you. You can buy the grip material that is on the BPS Carbonlite rods. It is a heat shrink material so it should have a large enough i.d. to fit over the butt of your rod and then heat it up to snug it down. I've never used it but have been wanting to try it out. I do know that it is super firm. Might be worth looking into.

http://www.mudhole.com/Shop-Our-Cata...er-Shrink-Tube

Give Todd or Bob at Mudhole a call or if you have a rod building supply shop close to you ask them about it.

SWEET!! Looks like that's what'll probably go with! I'm guessing I don't need epoxy for this either?

And would this be a full grip or a split grip rod? And could I get like a foot, and cut it into a 4", and 2.5".

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By god someone needs to try that shrink tubing,haha!
Thats actually gonna be your easiest route,using the shrink x wrap tubing..Stripping off EVA aint fun...Ive heard of the boiling method,but I dont have a pot that big..lol
Even when you chew,and shave off most the foam,you still have to sand,sand,sand.
A heat gun on LOW helps loosen the epoxy and you can use a dull instrument to scrape it off..Then a high grit sandpaper,then steel wool (my way)Its just trail and error on what works best...If you use a heat gun,work it fast and rotate the blank as you run it up and down.
If your just replacing the grips,then it shouldnt be to hard a task....Just go slow and be patient.

Or Joe will do it for $150!!..hahahaha!
Heat gun? Ya mean like a torch? I got ona them.
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Old 05-08-10, 04:19 PM   #20
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SWEET!! Looks like that's what'll probably go with! I'm guessing I don't need epoxy for this either?

And would this be a full grip or a split grip rod? And could I get like a foot, and cut it into a 4", and 2.5".
I don't know if you would need epoxy or not. I would think you would probably need something though. I don't know how tightly that stuff shrinks down. I would call and ask someone if I were you.

I'm sure that stuff is meant to be cut up and used at whatever length you want. You would just have to make sure to make good, straight cuts so that it looks good.
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Old 05-08-10, 04:19 PM   #21
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I'd definitely not use a torch lol. A heat gun is like a blow dryer, only hotter.

BB
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Old 05-08-10, 04:27 PM   #22
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I'd definitely not use a torch lol. A heat gun is like a blow dryer, only hotter.

BB
Grrr...

Could I use a blow dryer and just use it for a long time on it.

Or maybe put it a few feet over a hot stove??

p.s. - In case you guys have not noticed, am cheep!
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Old 05-08-10, 04:49 PM   #23
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OR, you could do what I've been trying to suggest without just saying it: Use the rod how it is.

BB
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Old 05-08-10, 05:12 PM   #24
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OR, you could do what I've been trying to suggest without just saying it: Use the rod how it is.

BB
What's the fun in that! And it can adsorb sweet on a long day and it becomes very uncomfortable!
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