Bass Fishing HomeBass Fishing Forums

Go Back   BassFishin.Com Forums > Additional Categories > Non-Fishing Related Talk

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 10-14-08, 06:01 PM   #51
flbassman
BassFishin.Com Super Veteran
 
flbassman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Jacksonville Florida
Posts: 2,840
Default

I don't know what part of the south yall grew up in, but around here, we still got plenty of racism......I grew up being told that black folks were lazy n------ that didn't want to work, and were less intelligent than me. It's only in the last three of four years after the immediate family cleaned up and by the grace of God that I've moved on from that. I've still got Uncle's cousins etc that would "kill any ----- that looks at my daughter/sister". You ever been to downtown Jacksonville? I've done AC work in the worst parts. If a white man were to walk down the length of Moncrief Rd at night, he'd be lucky to get out alive, and he would be guaranteed to be robbed. Even in the day, other contractors we knew have both been killed, and killed people in self defense. It's tough growing up poor and black. We were white trash when I was born, but I at least had a father, and both my parents had fathers, and I was told the importance of education from a young age. My heroes were older male relatives that fished, worked and hunted, not the gangsta's down the street sellin crack. My mom was home some, she made rules, and made sure I wasn't runnin around with hoodlums.

I'm not sayin that there aren't poor white people, or that it's impossible to get out of the ghetto. But it's awful tough growin up poor and black in the South ( or the North I guess), and if having a United Negro College fund is what it takes to get some kids out of that lifestyle, and have them be positive role models for kids where they grew up, I have no problem with it. I wish that we could look past color, but as a society that won't happen soon, so we're stuck with the NAACP, instead of the NAAP.....


As for Obama getting so far only because he's black, I disagree. The man is a hope machine. He is an inspiration to anybody in America who doesn't have a trust fund. If McCain becomes president, it will continue to prove that rich white guys from prominent political or millitary families, with the added bonus of strategic marriages can become president. If Obama wins, I could be president, and so could any person in the United States.
http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/10/...ref=newssearch <<<<<Interesting read.

Also, I was thinking, and I believe that the reason Clinton wasn't much of a sportsman was that he lived his whole life with either a single mother or an abusive stepfather. If he'd grown up on the family estate in Crawford, and spent summers in Kennebunkport, maybe he'd be more into fishin and huntin.......
__________________
R.I.P. Zooker
flbassman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-14-08, 06:32 PM   #52
MississippiBoy
BassFishin.Com Super Veteran
 
MississippiBoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Ridgeland MS
Posts: 3,923
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by flbassman View Post
I'm not sayin that there aren't poor white people, or that it's impossible to get out of the ghetto. But it's awful tough growin up poor and black in the South ( or the North I guess), and if having a United Negro College fund is what it takes to get some kids out of that lifestyle, and have them be positive role models for kids where they grew up, I have no problem with it. I wish that we could look past color, but as a society that won't happen soon, so we're stuck with the NAACP, instead of the NAAP.....
FL, what everybody is really getting at is where is the fairness? I have no problem at all trying to give some kids a leg up if they need it. Money to go to college to they can get themselves out of a bad situation and give their own kids a fighting chance later on? You betcha.

But where is the flip side of the coin? "United Negro College Fund." Available to blacks ONLY. That's racial discrimination. Point blank. "If you're not black, we're not going to help you." Businesses have been sued and lost everything over stuff like this. Except with the businesses, it was blacks being discriminated against.

And don't get me started on this catch phrase I hear every now and then: "Reverse discrimination," which people use to refer to discrimination against a white person. But realistically, the term it could be defined as "the opposite of discrimination." Which means nobody is unfairly treated, we're all happy and on equal footing. It's only "reverse" because it's against a white person.
MississippiBoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-14-08, 06:52 PM   #53
WTL
BassFishin.Com Premier Elite
 
WTL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Huntsville, Al
Posts: 7,466
Default

You know, Obama might be a nice guy. He might be an inspiration. He might be a good public speaker.

But he wont be a good President. His policies are bad. If you are bad at policy it doesnt matter if you are the son of a peanut farmer or a rhodes scholar from Hope, Arkansas or even the son of an Admiral, you will fail as President.

Thats why I have no hope.
__________________
Selling live waterdogs for less since 2005.
WTL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-08, 09:09 AM   #54
jcw1503
BassFishin.Com Veteran Member
 
jcw1503's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 617
Default

THere is no way that a white man who has had only a few years of government experience, been associated with terriost, been associated and purchased during a known time from a person involved in millions of dollars of fraud, get financial advice, political money, and a job from a person invovled ion fraud, and have a precher who puts down black people and uses God's name in vein and condems America, you know the place where you live, and will not say the pledge of alligiance, would be in the running for president of the United States......so actually looking at the situation, how can you not put that together...If its not because he is black then everywhere you go you would not see or hear people say even on TV interviews of citizens that they are voting for Obama because they want to see a Black Man in the White House...They didn't say.....Hey, I am voting for Obama because of his Economic Plan, or his War PLan, or his health CAre, No they say because he is Black.....Anyways, I am not saying racism is forever gone, that will probably never happen, but it goes back and fourth, white agains Black and Black against white....It happens and I have lived in many places in the south, from Jacksonville, to SC, to Virginia, considered racist places....But what people are trying to say is yeah we are sorry that happened years ago, but its not us, we didn't have a part of that, we are now, what we do now is what should be judged.....I did not grow up rich, I grew up as people considered white trash, in trailer parks, hand me downs was my new clothes, however, i am in better shape now, because i went to college, do you know how i paid for it, not a trust fund, its called a bank, you know they make these things called student loans, and don't say you can not get them, because anyone can... i worked my way through college, i have a butt load of loans, but hey i made it out.....so why should it just people for poorer black people, yeah, if they need help help them with a loan, but why should they get to go for free and i had to take tens of thousands of dollars of loans out to go...how is that fair.........MY family never had any money either side...i grew up with hardly any money...my ded worked 6 to 7 days a week but never made it great....however, he still voted for republicans, you know the ones you said that only the rich trust fund type people vote for....and one of the problems with Obama being a hope machine, is that yeah he is a normal guy, with a somewhat normal life, somehow he lives in only a few million dollar house..poor fellow..., is that yeah everyone wants to be able to be president, but to be president you have military intelligence, military is kind of a big part of a country's survival, and if you do not how it works or whats going on how can you run a country....
jcw1503 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-08, 10:58 AM   #55
Lilmoosecountry
BassFishin.Com Super Veteran
 
Lilmoosecountry's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Missouri
Posts: 1,322
Default

As a Christain my vote is very simple!!! Vote on the Godly issue's. Obama is a supporter of partial birth abortion. I know the Economy is in shambles. But i won't compermise my beliefs in a Temp. Finnacial set back. Liberals do support gay's being married. It also comes down to Honesty. Obama talks good. But that's it. He has no track record of doing any good as a Senator. Plain as day. There for the average american is dreaming that he will make any difference that is good. You get McCain or Obama Hussien that's it. If more people would have stood behind Ron Paul. Then we would have the most honest man. But what can i say. America alway's supports the the lyor's.
__________________
Live everyday as if it was your last & check your ego at the door!!! God is watching.
Lilmoosecountry is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-08, 11:08 AM   #56
doc
BassFishin.Com Super Veteran
 
doc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,134
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lilmoosecountry View Post
Liberals do support gay's being married. .

Not all of us!!

Last edited by doc; 10-15-08 at 11:21 AM.
doc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-08, 11:21 AM   #57
doc
BassFishin.Com Super Veteran
 
doc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,134
Default

Barrack Hussein Obamahttp://www.break.com/index/redneck-w...-on-obama.html

Is not a Terrorist, Arab, Muslim, or the Anti-Christ. If I get 1 more e-mail stating that he is I think I'm gonna scream. It is one thing to not like someone on the Issues. I personally do not like Obama, but stuff like this is just ridiculous.
doc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-08, 11:25 AM   #58
jcw1503
BassFishin.Com Veteran Member
 
jcw1503's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 617
Default

Same here, I am a christian also, and between gays and abortions there is absolutely no way i could vote for my financial situation over that, i have christian morals, and that i will not compromise...that said, i can not see how someone who claims they are christians can vote for a party who supports gay marriage and abortions, if they do then they are truly not a christian, because a christian would not put theirself before the christian beliefs....
jcw1503 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-08, 11:31 AM   #59
jcw1503
BassFishin.Com Veteran Member
 
jcw1503's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 617
Default

also, he verbally admitted to being muslim as he grew up, from his lips, and he converted to christianity, supposively, however, he continues to slip up in his interviews and speeches.....He will be talking and say my muslim faith believes, sometimes he realizes and tries to correct by saying i mean my christian faith, or someone else corrects him and then he tries to play it off, so its not lies... it has happened on national tv....and i am not saying he is a terroist, but he is not helping the public not to think that, when he has a muslim background and is associates with a known terroist....again i am not saying yay or nay on this subject...I am just putting some facts why it has came up...its up to an individual person to believe one way or the other....
jcw1503 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-08, 12:00 PM   #60
flbassman
BassFishin.Com Super Veteran
 
flbassman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Jacksonville Florida
Posts: 2,840
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lilmoosecountry View Post
As a Christain my vote is very simple!!! Vote on the Godly issue's.
Do you know John McCain's favorite bible verse? Cuz neither does he. After John 3:16 was suggested, he said, quote- "Is that the one about the end of the world?" http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=53743

It ain't all black and white. I'm pretty sick of being told by every "christian" (read-somebody who goes to church) that I know that if I support Obama, I'll be following America straight to hell. I would support the Republican party if they did what they were supposed to do. If they stayed out of my personal life, cut government spending, didn't get involved on stupid wars,
Now let me be clear – I suffer no illusions about Saddam Hussein. He is a brutal man. A ruthless man. A man who butchers his own people to secure his own power. He has repeatedly defied UN resolutions, thwarted UN inspection teams, developed chemical and biological weapons, and coveted nuclear capacity.
He’s a bad guy. The world, and the Iraqi people, would be better off without him.
But I also know that Saddam poses no imminent and direct threat to the United States, or to his neighbors, that the Iraqi economy is in shambles, that the Iraqi military a fraction of its former strength, and that in concert with the international community he can be contained until, in the way of all petty dictators, he falls away into the dustbin of history.
I know that even a successful war against Iraq will require a US occupation of undetermined length, at undetermined cost, with undetermined consequences. I know that an invasion of Iraq without a clear rationale and without strong international support will only fan the flames of the Middle East, and encourage the worst, rather than best, impulses of the Arab world, and strengthen the recruitment arm of al-Qaeda.
I am not opposed to all wars. I’m opposed to dumb wars.

-Barack Obama, In 2002



And backed conservative issues (protect the environment, drill offshore instead of in ANWR, leave my guns alone, overturn Roe Vs. Wade, and put prayer back in schools) I'd like 'em.
But the Republican party is worse than the democratic party about expanding the government, and giving tax cuts to people with no use for them, while making it harder on the middle class. Hey, lets just flip a TRILLION, a TRILLION, ONE THOUSAND BILLION, an infinite amount more in taxes than you and everyone you know will pay in their entire lifetimes, and toss it to the banks like a trillion bucks is what you wipe your *** with in Washington. AIG wants to spend 440,000 on a retreat the day after we bail them out, why not? It's only 440 grand. They needed 20 grand worth of spa treatments, it was a tough week.




Obama doesn't have enough experience, and if he wasn't a white woman who is moose hunting Alaskan with a pregnant teenage daughter, no one would pay any attention to him. Wait, that's not right, If he wasn't an insanely wealthy senator from Arizona who supported 75% of Bush's budget and sees no problem with another 50, maybe 100 years of blowin money in Iraq, because he's for the military dammit, and if being for the military means we lose 4,000 (much less than a trillion) American boys, along with 2 Billion a week, fighting for some sand, in a war that we've already either lost or won depending on how you look at it, so be it. No wait, that's wrong too.....


If you want to play the media card, then the only one who should be in the race is Biden. I don't like Biden, he's a career politician, and a bit of a jerk, and too liberal for my tastes, but he knows what he's doing.



If you want to play the working man card, look at Bush. Poor guy only has a net worth of between 7 and 18 million, despite the fact that he's never done a days worth of work in his life. But he served bravely in Vietnam, as a pilot (sort of) in the Texas Air national guard. McCain, also the son of working Navy admirals, who often had to stay home alone while his struggling parents had to spend the night shift hobknobbing, sometimes (this is tragic) at multiple parties in the course of one evening. McCain did serve with distinction in Vietnam, and because I respect that, I'll leave that alone. He then, through determination, calluses, and backbreaking manual labor, married the daughter of Phoenix's wealthiest beer distributor, after a complicated prenuptial agreement that would make him look less rich. In 2007, he made a mere 81 thousand off of social security and his navy pension. I'm sure thats much less than the average blue collar makes through menial peasant ways, like actual honest work. And this is the best part- He wants to cut welfare! So you're a starving inner city mom with 5 kids who works two jobs and goes to night school? Sorry, we gave all the money to wealthy Arizona senators. Maybe next year......


The other military card. Obama hates soldiers. There are authentic photographs on Rush Limbaugh's web site, right next to the Strom Thurmond shrine, that show Obama spitting on a flag, punching the child of a deployed soldier, and smoking an opium pipe with bin Laden. He never served in the military. I respect that. There were no active conflicts going on, and he had the grades, so instead of enlisting and soakin up the gravy, he went to college. Absurd. Obama wants to increase the size of the marines, and the army, while cutting some costs on defense contractors.



The Gay Rights/Abortion Card. God hates gays. That is plain, from the Bible. Homosexuals are a totally different breed of sinner from the rest of us, and have no place in American society. Jesus clearly said, "Judge gays, and definitely don't give them rights. They aren't even real people." Jesus would never have been seen hanging around prostitutes, or any other kind of sick person like that. It's not the sick who need a doctor, the healthy are busy getting routine checkups. Now I personally don't support homosexuality. But I am against the action, not the people. I have a couple gay friends. They're regular people, and are just a little confused. Does God view their adultery different from that of heterosexual adultery?

Abortion is murder. Plain and simple. But in the past 8 years of republican government, abortion is still cheap, legal and easy. And if we illegalize it, its gonna be done with coat hangers, or people are gonna jump off stuff. It's sick, but people are wicked, and that hasn't changed from the dawn of time till now.






The nice spring day, with bluebird skies, where you can see bass cruising, but they won't bite card. This issue pisses me off more than most of the rest. Sometimes a trick worm works, but sometimes not. As far as I can tell, neither candidate will make a solid stand here.

__________________
R.I.P. Zooker
flbassman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-08, 12:13 PM   #61
doc
BassFishin.Com Super Veteran
 
doc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,134
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jcw1503 View Post
i can not see how someone who claims they are christians can vote for a party who supports gay marriage and abortions, if they do then they are truly not a christian, because a christian would not put theirself before the christian beliefs....
I am a Christian, but I can't force my beliefs on anyone else. Seperation of church and state. I usually vote democratic, not on my christian beliefs but on my political views. I do not support abortion I support choice. How can I say that and be a Christian, its simple I live it.... I have a son who was born at 21 weeks weighing 1 pound 11 oz, my wifes water broke at 18 weeks, we were given the gloom and doom speech, had the choice to abort but did not. My son has Cerbal Paulsy he is an absolute joy, he is smart, determined, and unstopable. I also have a little girl who was born at 24 weeks weight 2.4 lbs and is perfectly fine.

That being said to force your beliefs on someone who does not believe as you do is aginst our very constitution and is what seperates or country from the rest of the world. Who am I to tell someone else what to do with their body? I am not god, that is between them and god.... A christian spreads the word, but cannot force people to follow it.
doc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-08, 12:13 PM   #62
flbassman
BassFishin.Com Super Veteran
 
flbassman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Jacksonville Florida
Posts: 2,840
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jcw1503 View Post
.that said, i can not see how someone who claims they are christians can vote for a party who supports gay marriage and abortions, if they do then they are truly not a christian, because a christian would not put theirself before the christian beliefs....
So I'm not a christian. And I'm proud, I guess. Because in my bible, that I read daily, it never says ANYTHING about politics, except "Give to Caesar what is Caesar's, and to God what is God's."

I'm so mad I'm shaking right now. I'm not a christian? Because I won't vote for a certain party? Never mind that I have visited other countries, feeding people, and telling them about Jesus. Forget that I'm going to Bible College to become a full time missionary. I like Obama more than McCain. I'm going to Hell. Who are you to tell me what I believe? I've never even met you, and here you are telling me that my political views invalidate my faith in Jesus? I have been 100% civil on this topic up till now, but when someone tells me, or anyone else, that political views take away from my faith in God, I get pretty close to forgettin all about Jesus, and saying some stuff I would regret.


I'm not a Christian because the party I support supports gay marriage and abortion. I don't know if you've been to busy listening to Sean Hannity to read your Bible, but if you open up to the Gospels (they're in the back, it's called the New Testament) you'll notice that Jesus Christ (the basis of Christianity, prior to Joel Osteen, Pat Robertson and Rick Warren) spent a lot of time around "sinners." Mary Magdalene, his closest follower outside the apostles, was a former prostitute. I could go on all day, but I'm just gonna leave it with a Marley (He was black! And he smoked weed! I'm gonna be seeing him in hell) quote, "I'm not perfect, and I don't live my life to be, but before you go pointing fingers, make sure your hands are clean."

Sincerely,
Flbassman- Not a real Christian.
__________________
R.I.P. Zooker
flbassman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-08, 01:09 PM   #63
jcw1503
BassFishin.Com Veteran Member
 
jcw1503's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 617
Default

Dude...seriously...i never said anything about you going to hell...and i never said anything about someone could not change and go from the worse person in the world and then become a christian, i never said that...there is this thing in the bible called the ten commandments, if i am not mistaken, does it not say thou shalt not kill...thats what abortion is...its killing a human life....and also, it says in different scriptures throughout the bible that a marriage is between a man and woman....and i never said i was perfect either..i sin just like everyone does, no one is perfect.....however, how can you purposely vote for a party who wants to legalize gay marriage, and abortion, and not to mention take god out of school, i am not saying you want any of this, i was asking how could you vote to put someone in office who will legalize this...I never said you were going to hell...so don't put words in my mouth....thats what i was saying....and again i am not saying i am perfect....I will never be close....and yeah Jesus hung around with sinners, but he preached to them, he tried to get them to change their ways to rightousness, and i am sure that Jesus would not take a sinner, who does not believe in what he preached and tried to rid of it, in charge a group of people and support him...listen i am not telling you what to believe each person has their own way of thinking of and seeing things...i am not judging you...thats no ones job except the lord himself...
jcw1503 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-08, 01:15 PM   #64
jcw1503
BassFishin.Com Veteran Member
 
jcw1503's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 617
Default

Again, i am not forcing my beliefs, i am standing for my beliefs, and i am wondering, when the choice is made for abortion, who is taking the child in questions vote...to me thats not choice if the life in uestion can not vote....Again, I am not forcing anything on anyone...I am simply stating my beliefs, do what you want with them...i am not here to judge anyone...and if i am not mistaken our country was based upon God...In God we Trust....One Nation under GOd...
jcw1503 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-08, 01:36 PM   #65
Lilmoosecountry
BassFishin.Com Super Veteran
 
Lilmoosecountry's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Missouri
Posts: 1,322
Default

JCW1503 it's cool. Don't worry about it. Athiest always seam to forget this country was founded by christian pilgrims. If it were'nt for chrisians the Athiest would be bass fishing in Siberia. It was the Christians that allowed them believe the way they do. It was the Christians that allowed Athiest in the country in the first place. As far as the Gay agenda thing goes. That's clearly laid out in the 1st chapter of Romans. Please Vote your way. But don't underestimate the Evangelical Vote. We have shown our power in Elections before. Besides when a mother looks at Abortions as a right. What about the babies rights.
__________________
Live everyday as if it was your last & check your ego at the door!!! God is watching.
Lilmoosecountry is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-08, 01:38 PM   #66
jcw1503
BassFishin.Com Veteran Member
 
jcw1503's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 617
Default

Thanks lilmoosecountry....
jcw1503 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-08, 02:28 PM   #67
doc
BassFishin.Com Super Veteran
 
doc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,134
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lilmoosecountry View Post
JCW1503 Athiest always seam to forget this country was founded by christian pilgrims.
The legitimate powers of government extend to such acts only as are injurious to others. But it does me no injury for my neighbor to say there are twenty gods, or no god. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg.[/I]
- Thomas Jefferson, Notes on the State of Virginia, 1781-82 (capitalization of the word god is retained per original)

No man shall be compelled to frequent or support any religious worship, place, or ministry whatsoever, nor shall be enforced, restrained, molested, or burthened in his body or goods, nor shall otherwise suffer, on account of his religious opinions or belief; but that all men shall be free to profess, and by argument to maintain, their opinions in matters of religion, and that the same shall in no wise diminish, enlarge, or affect their civil capacities.
- Thomas Jefferson, Virginia Statute for Religious Freedom (1779), quoted from Merrill D Peterson, ed., Thomas Jefferson: Writings (1984), p. 347

I never will, by any word or act, bow to the shrine of intolerance, or admit a right of inquiry into the religious opinions of others.
- Thomas Jefferson, letter to Edward Dowse, April 19, 1803

Because religious belief, or non-belief, is such an important part of every person's life, freedom of religion affects every individual. State churches that use government power to support themselves and force their views on persons of other faiths undermine all our civil rights. Moreover, state support of the church tends to make the clergy unresponsive to the people and leads to corruption within religion. Erecting the "wall of separation between church and state," therefore, is absolutely essential in a free society.]We have solved ... the great and interesting question whether freedom of religion is compatible with order in government and obedience to the laws. And we have experienced the quiet as well as the comfort which results from leaving every one to profess freely and openly those principles of religion which are the inductions of his own reason and the serious convictions of his own inquiries.
- Thomas Jefferson, to the Virginia Baptists (1808). This is his second use of the term "wall of separation," here quoting his own use in the Danbury Baptist letter. This wording was several times upheld by the Supreme Court as an accurate description of the Establishment Clause: Reynolds (98 US at 164, 1879); Everson (330 US at 59, 1947); McCollum (333 US at 232, 1948)"

Some theists fall back on the fact that, since Christianity is the dominant religion in the U.S., both at its founding and now, this makes it a “Christian nation” and that’s the end of it. This is, however, majoritarianism, something which most of the Founding Fathers opposed, and which the U.S. government is specifically designed to guard against. Using majoritarianism to declare the U.S., an anti-majoritarian state, “Christian” is simply ridiculous.



The founding fathers were a group of (LIBERAL) Immigrants whom the majority happend to be christian (tho not in the christian sense we know today). That knew the importance of founding a Country not on Christian beliefs, but beliefs of all kind in the name of FREEDOM.

Last edited by doc; 10-15-08 at 02:33 PM.
doc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-08, 02:38 PM   #68
doc
BassFishin.Com Super Veteran
 
doc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,134
Default

[quote=Lilmoosecountry;206934] don't underestimate the Evangelical Vote. We have shown our power in Elections before.quote]

Perhaps the most famous statement made by Jesus is “Give to Caesar what is Caesar’s and to God what is God’s” see Matthew 22:21, Mark 12:17, and Luke 20:25. Many of Jesus’ teachings centered on defining the difference between the spiritual and the physical; and he assigned government (metaphorically, “Caesar”) to the realm of the physical. He generally encouraged his followers to concern themselves with the spiritual and not the physical.

Thus, to be a Christian means not concerning oneself overly with statecraft, and in turn this implies strongly that Christianity does not favor any particular kind of state, or take any interest in the creation of states.
doc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-08, 02:57 PM   #69
flbassman
BassFishin.Com Super Veteran
 
flbassman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Jacksonville Florida
Posts: 2,840
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jcw1503 View Post
Dude...seriously...i never said anything about you going to hell...
^^^^^^
Quote:
Originally Posted by jcw1503 View Post
i can not see how someone who claims they are christians can vote for a party who supports gay marriage and abortions, if they do then they are truly not a christian
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lilmoosecountry View Post
JCW1503 it's cool. Don't worry about it. Athiest always seam to forget this country was founded by christian pilgrims. If it were'nt for chrisians the Athiest would be bass fishing in Siberia. It was the Christians that allowed them believe the way they do. It was the Christians that allowed Athiest in the country in the first place. As far as the Gay agenda thing goes. That's clearly laid out in the 1st chapter of Romans. Please Vote your way. But don't underestimate the Evangelical Vote. We have shown our power in Elections before. Besides when a mother looks at Abortions as a right. What about the babies rights.
The Christian vote and the republican vote are not the same thing. I believe in Jesus, attend Church, and do my best to spread the Gospel. But I am not a sheep that follows the republican party. I supported Bush after 9/11. I think he did a good job. But I think we've had enough republican economics for the time being.

Please, someone, answer me this: If, as republicans, you are all so anti-abortion and anti-gay marriage, why are both gay marriage and abortion legal after we've had a Republican president for 8 years?
__________________
R.I.P. Zooker
flbassman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-08, 03:12 PM   #70
lowrider
BassFishin.Com Veteran Member
 
lowrider's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: South Arkansas
Posts: 937
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lilmoosecountry View Post
Athiest always seam to forget this country was founded by christian pilgrims.
weren't these the same puritanical zealots that burned innocent people at the stake for imagined whitchcraft? hmmmmmmmmmmmm
lowrider is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-08, 03:15 PM   #71
flbassman
BassFishin.Com Super Veteran
 
flbassman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Jacksonville Florida
Posts: 2,840
Default

Republicans were also the fun people responsible for McCarthyism!
__________________
R.I.P. Zooker
flbassman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-08, 03:22 PM   #72
jcw1503
BassFishin.Com Veteran Member
 
jcw1503's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 617
Default

I never said that the government should force religion upon you...however, rather you like it or not God is a big part of our countries history....anf since you gave a history lesson let me give one......one from every history book....

1620[/B] - The Mayflower Compact written by the Pilgrims before they got off the Mayflower said: "In the presence of God, Amen. We ... do by these presents solemnly and mutually in ye presence of God, and one another, covenant and combine ourselves into a civil body politic." ....

1638 - The Fundamental Orders of Connecticut (often called the first American Constitution) said, We "enter into a combination and confederation together to maintain and preserve the liberty and purity of the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ which we now profess." It also stated for the first time that men's rights come from God, as later stated in the Declaration of Independence. ....

1772 - Samuel Adams: "The right to freedom being the gift of God Almighty ... The rights of the colonists as Christians may be best understood by reading and carefully studying the institutes of the great Law Giver which are to be found clearly written and promulgated in the New Testament." ...

1777 - The First Continental Congress appropriated funds to import for the people 20,000 Holy Bibles as "the great political textbook of the patriots." ...

1776 - The Declaration of Independence says: "We hold these truths to be self evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness - That to secure these rights, governments are instituted among men ... "

There you have some profound statements:

* There is such a thing as Truth, and Truth can be known by man.

* Men are "created" and their rights come from God, their Creator.

* Governments exist to protect these God-given rights.


This is the very essence of our Americanism! ....

1787 - George Washington said regarding the Constitution: "Let us raise a standard to which the wise and honest can repair; the event is in the hand of God."....

And how about Thomas Jefferson....

Thomas Jefferson, on his memorial: "God who gave us life, gave us liberty. Can the liberties of a nation be secure when we have removed a conviction that the liberties are the gift of God?" 2 Corinthians 3:17: "Where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is Liberty."....

1787- Washington's Inaugural Address: "The propitious smiles of heaven cannot be expected on a nation that disregards the eternal rules of order and right, which heaven itself has ordained." All inaugural addresses and state constitutions refer to Almighty God, the author and sustainer of our liberty.

1789 - Washington's Thanksgiving Proclamation: "Whereas, it is the duty of all nations to acknowledge the providence of Almighty God, to obey His will, to be grateful for His benefits and humbly to implore His protection and favor..."

Patrick Henry: "It cannot be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great nation was founded not by religionists but by Christians, not on religions but on the gospel of Jesus Christ."

John Quincy Adams: "The first and almost the only Book deserving of universal attention if the Bible." The highest glory of the American Revolution was this: "It connected in one indissoluble bond the principles of civil government with the principles of Christianity."

1789-1795 - John Jay, first chief justice of the United States: "Providence has given to our people the choice of their rulers, and it is the duty as well as the privilege and interest, of a Christian nation to select and prefer Christians for their rulers."

1861 - Abraham Lincoln: "It is the duty of all nations, as well as of men, to own their dependence upon the overruling power of God and to recognize the sublime truth announced in the Holy Scriptures and proven by all history, that those nations only are blessed whose God is the Lord."

1863 - Abraham Lincoln's Gettysburg Address: "That we here highly resolve ... that this nation under God shall have a new birth of freedom and that government of the people, by the people, for the people shall not perish from the earth."
.....

I am going to stop the history lesson here, because it can go on and on....

I am not trying to force religion on you and i am not wanting anyone to do that....

However, as i was saying before that a christian should not try to appoint someone their leader if it compromises their morals....and i back that up by quoting the 1st commanment.....
thou shalt have no other god before me...
jcw1503 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-16-08, 12:25 PM   #73
Bob Smith
BassFishin.Com Super Veteran
 
Bob Smith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Cartersville, Georgia
Posts: 1,472
Default

Personally, I do not believe we've actually seen true Republican Economics since the Reagan Era. So to say these economic failures are a part of the Bush economic plan would be a tremendous overstatement. some of the reactionary tactics to control it have his signature, but the overall failure should be linked to the Democratic majority in Congress more than the whitehouse.
I won' weigh in on the moral issues, I am too conservative to wage an effective arguement on that, I just disagree totally with the economic insinuations. I think that propaganda approach has run it's course already!
__________________
Bob Smith a.k.a. "Porko" (vintage Strike King variety!)
Bob Smith is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-16-08, 12:35 PM   #74
doc
BassFishin.Com Super Veteran
 
doc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,134
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jcw1503 View Post
I never said that the government should force religion upon you...however, rather you like it or not God is a big part of our countries history....anf since you gave a history lesson let me give one......one from every history book....

1620[/b] -

1638 - The Fundamental Orders of Connecticut (often called the first American Constitution) But it is not the first american constitution said, We "enter into a combination and confederation together to maintain and preserve the liberty and purity of the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ which we now profess." It also stated for the first time that men's rights come from God, as later stated in the Declaration of Independence. ....



1776 - The Declaration of Independence says: "We hold these truths to be self evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness - That to secure these rights, governments are instituted among men ... " This is a prime example of my statement, it does not say god it says "their Creator" you being christian assume god, but it is a blanket statement referring to "their Creator" or whatever god they worship. good point.

There you have some profound statements:



However, as i was saying before that a christian should not try to appoint someone their leader if it compromises their morals....and i back that up by quoting the 1st commanment.....
thou shalt have no other god before me...
I also back up my statement of Thus, to be a Christian means not concerning oneself overly with statecraft, and in turn this implies strongly that Christianity does not favor any particular kind of state, or take any interest in the creation of states. give to cesar what is cesars and god what is gods.

Some theists fall back on the fact that, since Christianity is the dominant religion in the U.S., both at its founding and now, this makes it a “Christian nation” and that’s the end of it. This is, however, majoritarianism, something which most of the Founding Fathers opposed, and which the U.S. government is specifically designed to guard against. Using majoritarianism to declare the U.S., an anti-majoritarian state, “Christian” is simply ridiculous.


The quotes were great, they all follow my beliefs, but it does not change the fact that this country is free, and using chrisitan beliefs, to elect an official to push a christian agenda on non christians is aginst the constitution, plain and simple.

The founding fathers were a group of (LIBERAL) Immigrants whom the majority happend to be christian (tho not in the christian sense we know today). That knew the importance of founding a Country not on Christian beliefs, but beliefs of all kind in the name of FREEDOM.

They might have been christian, but the intent was a free country where every individual had the right to choose what religion they followed.

Last edited by doc; 10-16-08 at 12:42 PM.
doc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-16-08, 01:53 PM   #75
jcw1503
BassFishin.Com Veteran Member
 
jcw1503's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 617
Default

the reason i gave the history lesson, was that it was implied that God was not a big part of America when it was founded....and I have no problem giving to Caesar, the president or government, which ever you consider Caesar, as long as it does not compromise what i owe to God, examples:

supporting gays: bible says a marriage is between a man and woman....

supporting abortion: bible says thou shalt not kill.....

compromising your religious beleifs for your financial or what ever benefits: Bible says thou shalt have no other god before me......


And how many times do i have to say it...here it will use all capital letters so maybe yall can read it this time..... "They might have been christian, but the intent was a free country where every individual had the right to choose what religion they followed." by doc....


I AM NOT WANTING TO PUSH RELIGION ON ANYONE...YOUR RELIGION OR NON-RELIGION IS YOUR CHOICE....I WILL TRY TO TESTIFY AND HELP YOU...BUT I WILL, REPEAT, I WILL NEVER TRY OR WANT ANYONE TO FORCE RELIGION......

All I am saying is that i will not put my religious beliefs behing my personal benefits....



And as for the gay marriage and abortion....just because the president is republican does not mean that they can do anything by themselves, and the same goes for the economy...every body tries to blame bush for passed laws and non passed laws....did you know that 5 out of the 8 years that bush was in the white house it was democratic house.....and during the clinton administration.....what everyone says that he did a great job with the economy.....all of his term it was a republican house...
jcw1503 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Disclosure / Disclaimer
Before acting on the content posted, you should know that BassFishin.Com may benefit financially and otherwise from content, advertising, links or otherwise from anything you click on, read, or look at on our website. Click here to read our Disclosure Policy and Disclaimer.


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 06:42 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2023, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
© 2013 BassFishin.Com LLC