graphite reel frames

[unbiased14]

Everywhere I go I here people talking about graphite in reel cosntruction and how it's absolute junk and should be avoided. I don't get this because I've ONLY fished graphite framed baitcasters and spinning reels ever since I started fishing. Well, half true. the only reels i've fished that have aluminum in the frames are 3 different fly reels that I moslty use for rare trout and occasional bass fishing. Most of my experience comes by way of two reels i've fished for years with no problems. 1) abu garcia silver max, and 2)shimano FX4000FD. i'm gonna try to ballpark the amount of time i've spent fishing each reels. Abu: 120-160 hours, Shimano: 250-300 hours. I fished with spinning reels for about 4-5 years when I was younger, but I changed to baitcasting, just because they feel a bit more ergonomic to me when palming the reel, and because I think they give me a little more versatility in my presentation.

I didn't fish as hard as I do now with my reels, so for the majority of this discussion, i'll refer to my experience with my Silver max.

I done a lot with this reel, and fished in both fresh and saltwater. Most of the time though, i've just been bass fishing in a couple local lakes and ponds. about 80% of my bass have been pulled in with this reel. also a couple of flounder that I caught on a saltwater trip in new jersey. THis reel has been through a lot of hard hook sets, a few hard fights muscling flounder off the bottom, and pulling in a lot of salad and lily pads when I got my spinnerbait snagged or when a fish buried it self in salad.

I'll start by saying that this reel has NEVER failed on me. I've never had a part break, or even felt or seen the reel flex. or had a problem with graphite frames ever. And that's all i've ever fished!

I've also never had a problem with another baitcaster that i've fished a little longer in the salt with, the bass pro bionic plus (old version). as well as the shimano FX. Please chime in if anyone else has experience with graphite reels.

[CamG]

If they are working for you then don't worry about it. Bass fishing doesn't have to be a fashion show for people to enjoy it.

Having said all of that, I have seen graphite fail on the water. But, that was only one time. I think for most people they server the purpose well.

[DVT Mike]

Just because Aluminum or magnesium may be stronger doesn't necessarily mean graphite is bad. The higher end reels don't use graphite due to it's flex which is not conducive to the tighter tolerances.

[unbiased14]

I totally agree with everything you guys say. And I have no doubt that the aluminum reels are stronger and will be more durable, but I still wonder why some people feel like they have to bomb graphite reels because they're not what they're used to, or because they had one problem or another.

But I feel that 100% of graphite reels will not perform just like MY silver max. there are probably some that might perform better, or worse. All i'm saying is that I have a system that works for me, and that just fine and dandy. there's nothing wrong with that. I just don't get how some people think that because something doesn't work for them specifically, they feel that it won't work for everyone.

[DVT Mike]

Some folks are just rabid about brands, styles or whatever they think is best. I've had people tell me GMC pick-ups are the bomb but Chevy Silverado sucks. How can a pair of emblems accomplish that?lol

[unbiased14]

I guess some people are just biased and feel like one company or another is best and everyone else sucks, or won't give whatever product a fair look or opinion just because a certain company makes it. Kind of like the attitude that Cold steel knives has or maybe G Loomis trying to justify a 150$ 5'4" light action spinning rod as a "good cheap rod" just because it has the G Loomis name on it.

I've held some of the higher end GL's (not sure of model name, but I think they were around 295$) and they don't feel any better than my field and stream Tec Spec flipping stick (Awesome rod by the way!) which ran me about 60$! or the St. Croix triumph which ran 10$ more than the F and S!

[MIbasser]

I think it's all about keeping up with the Jones'. Some people like to have nice things to look at and use once and awhile. Me, I like to have nice things because I know that they are going to take a beating and I'll spend extra $ knowing that it will last longer.

[unbiased14]

Like for fashion. I guess they think "What's it style is all that'll work."

I just like stuff that works. It doesn't matter to me what's in style or not.
I am a believer in split grips though; but that doesn't mean i'll bomb rods with regular grips. I just think that there are pros and cons to each design.

[BigBassin144]

Originally Posted by unbiased14

I totally agree with everything you guys say. And I have no doubt that the aluminum reels are stronger and will be more durable, but I still wonder why some people feel like they have to bomb graphite reels because they're not what they're used to, or because they had one problem or another.

But I feel that 100% of graphite reels will not perform just like MY silver max. there are probably some that might perform better, or worse. All i'm saying is that I have a system that works for me, and that just fine and dandy. there's nothing wrong with that. I just don't get how some people think that because something doesn't work for them specifically, they feel that it won't work for everyone.

Graphite reels do flex. You probably won't be able to see it, but it does. And every time it does, it throw the gears out of alignment. Again, it may be so slight you've never notice it. But in the long run, especially if you fish with your gear a lot, that graphite reel with break before an Aluminum one (assuming there's no other issues with either reel).

I don't believe most people think that what works for them will work for everybody. But when asked for their opinions, I'm sure everyone will share their experience. You asked what's so bad about graphite reels, and I'm sure some people have had some bad experiences. That shouldn't be interpreted as them assuming it won't work for you, it's just them sharing their experiences to answer your question.

Originally Posted by DVT Mike

Some folks are just rabid about brands, styles or whatever they think is best. I've had people tell me GMC pick-ups are the bomb but Chevy Silverado sucks. How can a pair of emblems accomplish that?lol

Now THAT'S sad. I hope you smacked those people upside the head...

Originally Posted by unbiased14

I guess some people are just biased and feel like one company or another is best and everyone else sucks, or won't give whatever product a fair look or opinion just because a certain company makes it. Kind of like the attitude that Cold steel knives has or maybe G Loomis trying to justify a 150$ 5'4" light action spinning rod as a "good cheap rod" just because it has the G Loomis name on it.

I've held some of the higher end GL's (not sure of model name, but I think they were around 295$) and they don't feel any better than my field and stream Tec Spec flipping stick (Awesome rod by the way!) which ran me about 60$! or the St. Croix triumph which ran 10$ more than the F and S!

I think for the most part, you do get what you pay for. While in cases like G Loomis, you do pay a lot for the name. But swinging the rod around in a store in no substitute for on the water experience. I own and fish a couple of those G Loomis models (IMX by the way) that you're talking about. And I can tell you, from experience, they perform better than any $100 rod I've fished.

Until you get some time on the water fishing a G Loomis, or other higher end rod, please don't tell me that they feel no better than your $60 F&S rod.

They say ignorance is bliss, maybe it is...

Originally Posted by unbiased14

I just like stuff that works. It doesn't matter to me what's in style or not.
I am a believer in split grips though; but that doesn't mean i'll bomb rods with regular grips. I just think that there are pros and cons to each design.

I don't believe that higher end rods and reels can be considered "in style" or even a style at all. People like them because they work better. So graphite construction aside, how do you know your Abu Garcia Silver Max reel is letting you fish to your full potential? How do you know it's letting you work the best you can. It's like trying to drive a screw in with a drill with an almost dead battery and one with a fresh battery. Sure, the almost dead one will work to drive the screw in, but the fresh battery will work better.

I'd also like to know what you mean by you're a believer in split grips? You believe they reduce the weight of the rod on the wrong side of the fulcrum or you believe they're purely aesthetic? What is it about them you believe?

Finally, I'd like to challenge you to go out and buy a good rod and reel combo. (If you can't, find a fishing buddy who will let you use theirs for a day). Then I'd like you to tell me the that it's no better than your Silver Max and F&S rod.

Now so you don't take this the wrong way, I'd like to point out the fact that I'm not saying your combo doesn't work for you. It just seems to me like you're saying that higher end stuff, just because it may not work for you (or perhaps you just don't want it to), other's shouldn't use it either. Now I'm a strong believer in the fact that a person's money is theirs and it's none of my damn business how they spend it. So if you're happy with your combo, that's fine. I would still recommend trying to get some on the water time with some higher end gear, because like I always tell people: It's hard to go backwards!

BB

[dave0943]

Lets say for the record that I buy only aluminum body, rotor, etc reels. I can't say that the reels with graphite body, rotor, are lousy. It would just make sense the metal body would be built better. I just prefer not to take a chance. The price difference between a
aluminum reel ang a graphite body aren't really that much. Take a reel like Bass pro's PQ
baitcasting reel 79.00 on sale and a Silver max, I'm guessing 59.00. Is 20.00 worth peace of mind? Maybe graphite will hold up the same, mabe not. For 20.00, I'm not going to take a chance. It would be my luck to have a fish of a life time lost because of a reel breaking down. By the way my son started on a graphite body spinning reel and still has it many years later!

[Raul]

I´ve owned graphite frame reels and all of them broke on accidents, I don´t mean they didn´t work, I mean they broke, I had this Slistar BC reel I liked very much, one day while in the process of placing it on the rod it slipped from my hand and fell waist height ( and I ain´t THAT tall ) on the floor, landed on the reel foot and it broke, a piece of the foot was lost and the frame cracked. Also I had a Shimano Sedona, my compadre stepped by accident on the foot and it broke. Both reels after that were useless.

If my Silstar were aluminum frame that accident would most probably end with a bump on the reel foot and not a breakeage, why ? cuz I´ve dropped by accident other reels and that´s what happened. As for the Sedona, I bet that the most that could have happened after my compadre stepped on it would have been a bent reel foot.

So, no more graphite frame reels for me.

[walkeraviator]

I have an Abu Garcia Maxxar reel that was about a $30 reel when it was purchased in the mid 90's. It is graphite, has been absolutely abused, and still goes fishing with me all the time. I have never seen first hand evidence of aluminum frames being superior to graphite frames. However, I have a new Pro Qualifier I paid about the same amount for as I did my Abu Pro Max. Ignoring the frame material, for the same price range, the PQ is 10x the reel. I dont buy reels based on what they are made of... i buy for performance, and aluminum frames just tend to be a byproduct.

[Dave63]

I've got some and I've never had an issue with them. Never. That includes a trip out of the boat onto the asphalt at highway speed. One of them I would consider crap, but for the price I paid for it, I expect it to be crap. It flexes and I can feel it. The other ones I can't tell.

[Lvitch]

With the hours you mentioned, I would consider that recreational use. Their fine for that. Fish multiple tournaments a month and you'll feel a huge difference. Set the hook on an aluminum frame reel, and then on a graphite frame one and you'll feel the flex. Over the course of a hard day of power fishing cranks or spinnerbaits you'll feel it as well. Not to say their all that bad. But for the money you can spend 20-30$ more and get better reel that will last longer with less chance of failure. BPS has aluminum frame reels I believe for about $50 or less. I would say I probably fish close to 50 hrs a month avg and know guys that fish 100+ hrs a month. I wouldn't feel comfortable fishing all graphite reels at that pace. Bottom line, use what works for you.

[Jrob78]

All the graphite framed reels I ever owned started off as good reels, some of them very good. None of them made it longer than about a season though. I wasn't particularly hard on them but they definitely got used a lot. All of them suffered some sort of catastophic failure.

I found that buying a reel for $50 is way more expensive than buying a better one at twice the price. It is my experience that graphite framed reels don't last as long as aluminum framed reels.

[tim4081]

Originally Posted by Jrob78

All the graphite framed reels I ever owned started off as good reels, some of them very good. None of them made it longer than about a season though. I wasn't particularly hard on them but they definitely got used a lot. All of them suffered some sort of catastophic failure.

I found that buying a reel for $50 is way more expensive than buying a better one at twice the price. It is my experience that graphite framed reels don't last as long as aluminum framed reels.

This has been my experience as well. I fish about 60 to 80 hours a month on average and the graphite framed reels just don't hold up over time. I've only had one break but the others I've had have gotten very rough on the retrieve. Probably due to the flexing of the frame and gears getting out of alignment.

[Tavery5]

I guess you could look at from this perspective, What is the benefit of graphite? I have thought about it and truly can't think of anything other than it may be a little lighter than aluminum reels in the same price point. I think the reason graphite reels get a bad rap is because they are typically reels on the very low end of a lineup. I am sure they have their place in the market, but it seems that they offer no real benefit to date. It would be interesting to see a company make a very high end graphite reel and see how it would be received.

[BigBassin144]

Originally Posted by Tavery5

It would be interesting to see a company make a very high end graphite reel and see how it would be received.

No one has done so with a casting reel, but that's basically all the Revo Premier, Stradic CI4, and Daiwa Fuego spinning reels are.

BB

[Ebbetsguy]

Originally Posted by tim4081

This has been my experience as well. I fish about 60 to 80 hours a month on average and the graphite framed reels just don't hold up over time. I've only had one break but the others I've had have gotten very rough on the retrieve. Probably due to the flexing of the frame and gears getting out of alignment.

I fish about 100 days a year, because I live in the Hard Water Zone. I have fished Pflueger President Spinning Reels, for a lot of years, not one issue as stated here.Not only that most of the fellas I fish with, when using spinning equipmrnt, use the same reel, you know why: NO ISSUES, over a great many seasons for a lot of fellas. I am not saying a bail has never gotten stuck, or dirt in a drag, thats somewhat normal for reels used hard.
We have a friend called YAK, he's huge, we tride to see if he could snap a president off at the handle ,while attached to the rod, something he has done to 2 other reels., couldnt do it. I would say that Daiwa and Okums spinning reels, also of graphite stnd up b/c those are also used a lot around here, without major oncerns, most with graphite bodies

Maybe when a pro or two endorses one, the rest of the sheep heard will follow,GEEZZ!!!!!!!

These concerns are usually started in print, by advertisers and become what the fishing world repeats and believes.
As far as Baitcasting, I have no opinion, as the reels I have used,Mostly Trions and Extremes, have all been Aluminum, so no opions here on those

[WTL]

When you see a car with lots of plastic trim, what do you think? Some might say "oooh space age materials for high weight to strength ratio" but most people say that the manufacturer is saving money with cheaper processes.

That is what you get with graphite in baitcasters, and from my experience it is justified. All a graphite frame means is that it is a less expensive reel, and less expensive reels are more likely to break. That doesnt mean that for a while they dont work, or if you keep the hours down they will stay in shape. You get what you paid for (which isn't a bad thing, $50 buys you some decent performance these days, just dont expect it to outlast an Abu reel and you will be satisfied).


One last thing; it is not a marketing ploy implanted by advertising execs when people are wary of lesser grade materials. Mechanical experiences with failure naturally condition people to expect less from lesser quality - no marketing needed.

[Ebbetsguy]

I could have sworn, I was speaking about spinning reels, not baitcasting. As you know ,unlike many I do not pretend to speak about what I do not know from first hand observation


wait , what's the last line I wrote

Lets see now, copied and pasted for viewing accuracy:

As far as Baitcasting, I have no opinion, as the reels I have used,Mostly Trions and Extremes, have all been Aluminum, so no opions here on those

Oh I was right I did write about graphite spinning reels

whew got confused there for a minute

[Tavery5]

Originally Posted by BigBassin144

No one has done so with a casting reel, but that's basically all the Revo Premier, Stradic CI4, and Daiwa Fuego spinning reels are.

BB

True, and all these reels seem to have been received well. While they are graphite based reels, I am not sure, because of the difference in design, that they are subjected to the same type of forces as a baitcaster, and what may work well in this instance, does not seem to hold true in the other.

The Nano Shield technology that Abu is using, or one similar may hold the answer to producing high end graphite based BC reels. But for now, most anglers that prefer to use the upper end offerings of BC reels typically use sideplate material as one of the criteria to help determine quality of the reel.

Regardless, I will continue to fish BC reels made from one of the many aluminums until they are no longer available.

[CamG]

Originally Posted by Ebbetsguy

I could have sworn, I was speaking about spinning reels, not baitcasting. As you know ,unlike many I do not pretend to speak about what I do not know from first hand observation


wait , what's the last line I wrote

Lets see now, copied and pasted for viewing accuracy:

As far as Baitcasting, I have no opinion, as the reels I have used,Mostly Trions and Extremes, have all been Aluminum, so no opions here on those

Oh I was right I did write about graphite spinning reels

whew got confused there for a minute

Why are you ALWAYS the one who must try to pick a fight? I believe this thread was pretty civilized until you started in with your jabs and

[Ebbetsguy]

Fight??????
I was bustin on him for missing that
There is no fight, you have to be less sensitive
That whole reply was tounge in cheek
Sorry if your having a Bad day

[CamG]

OK Muddy.