Color vision in Bass?

[HarveysMinnow]

I suspect this topic has been covered in previous threads posted in earlier times, but when I first joined this Forum, Kevin told me “… generally speaking, it is advisable to not dredge up old threads if you can avoid it by posting a new thread.”
So, here goes …

It seems that everyone who fishes a lot develops certain mindsets about lure colors and we eventually develop strong preferences for certain colors, based largely on the degree of success we’ve had in the past. If these colors catch more fish for us, we have little or no reason to change. I dare say that, when we are catching good Bass on our favorite colored lures, not one of us is going to suddenly change to a different color, just to see if we still catch fish.

On the other hand, when I’m fishing and getting no action, I’m as likely as the next guy to change the colors of my baits. After all, what have I got to lose if they ain’t biting anyway. But I have wondered, during my years of Bass fishing, if the big-uns lurking out there really care as much about color as I or other fishermen do. Apparently I’m not the only one who sometimes commits a breach of faith and wonders if colors really matter. In Cassidyda’s recent thread on “Sweeping a Buzzbait”, fellow member Boloson commented:

Originally Posted by boloson

it just goes to show u that u could probably throw a piece of string with some rattle attached to it & probably catch a fish as long as there are fish in that area. makes me wonder if colors on lures actually makes a difference?

I have frequently been skeptical about what Bass actually see and I have considered the possibility that they don’t perceive things in the same ways as we do. Even if they do see colors, do they actually have preferences? When I’m in a tackle store, I stand there and think “that lure color looks more appetizing than this one”, but is a Bass going to actually make a conscious choice on that basis? It seems more likely to me that he just reacts instinctively, and his strike is the result of overall size, shape, and presentation of the bait. I guess I wonder about such things more in the Winter, when there’s more time to think and it’s too cold to fish anyway.

So, the major question at the moment is … does anyone know of any concrete evidence that Bass actually do see colors and make distinctions based on what colors they see? (In the absence of concrete evidence, I’ll even be satisfied with asphalt evidence.) And even if they can tell one color from another, do they really have favorites? I shudder to think of all the other variables, but I feel sure that some Ichthyologist at some time has attempted to devise a controlled experiment to characterize the vision of various fish. But the nice thing about this Forum is, it’s just tons easier to ask you guys, than to try digging it out of the Internet. However, here is one ‘food for thought’ entry:

http://www.ccmr.cornell.edu/educatio....html?quid=295

/

[Ebbetsguy]

Very good topic. I first went looking for research many years ago, stumbled onto Dr.Jones book, and was put off when I saw it was a Berkley paid project and there were passages from the book, on their gulp products, which was more about scent , than anything else
I used to think the chartreuse and bubblegum baits in cloudy and muddy water made sense. Then after many fishing trips, hooking bass in water with terrible visibility and while removing the hooks from them, they threw up a load of dark colored Crawfish and or minnows, that theory went out the window for me, the lure sellers still love it!

anyways here is what works for me
Cranks and top waters;
Greens, gold, silver/black and BLACK!!!!
Soft Plastics: All shades of Green, Brown ,Purple and black
Jigs, much the same

and that’s it for me. On days when the fish are hot, you really can throw anything out them, There is a great version of LUNKERVILLE, where Mike D is fishing with Russ ( Low Budget Hookers) , throwing Trick Sticks ( Alluring Senko type bait) and every time they catch a fish Russ switches up on colors and catches the next one, I have fished with Russ and know this to be true
On hard days for me that means , the fish want it right in front of them and it's always a matter of presentation and location and not much to do with color, as long as I am sticking to the basic colors I throw and that’s all I own. I found that BIG BASS get that way because they avoid pressure and they are no as smart as many make them

[Ebbetsguy]

How come Jigs work so Good then? I am not trying to be disrespectful, I find this topic and all it's possibilities very interesting and would like as many answers, from the collected FIRST HAND EXPERIENCE here, as possible

How come I have caught very good fish on a jig and plastic that imitates a craw fish on a lake where they are not the forage

How come I have caught good fish on a gold Shad Rap on lakes where there are no shad?

How come I kill them with Manns Grape Jelly Worms and my Partner is having equal luck with Green Trick worms, on the same day, same boat and same structure?

[boloson]

as soon as i read your post i immediately thought of this vid:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJvVkBcbFFY

he talks of night fishing and colors. according to him, black is the only color and best color a bass can see. he also mentioned day time fishing where everything is more visible and bass can perceive that they are being pursued.
i thought this was contradicting of his own comments but then again i've never been night fishing before. are bass more active during the night? if so then there might be some correlation between colors & the time of day

[Ebbetsguy]

Thanks Boloson: most of my fishing is night fishing , lately. My biggest producer number wise; 5/8 ounce jointed Jitterbug in BLACK!

[carolina-rig-01]

I don't know if anyone can say for sure what fish see. I know you asked for concrete evidence and not opinions, but my opinion is all I have to offer. I believe that fish do see colors, whether of not they see the same colors in the same way that we do..............I can't say for sure. But I can say that when I see a lot of shad activity in an area I generally get a lot more bites on a shad colored bait than on other colors. However if you can pay all the attention you want to colors but if you aren't around fish you aren't going to get bit. I think bait colors are a very important part of catching fish but they are still behind finding the fis.

I would rather throw the wrong bait in the right spot than the right bait in the wrong spot.

[nofearengineer]

Bass do have cone structures in their eyes, so they do have color vision. However, most research indicates that they do not see colors at the "right" end of the visible (to humans) spectrum; i.e, blue, indigo, and violet. (I know this would tend to shoot the "blue jig" theory in the pants, but it's not a 100% proven theory.)

Add to this the physical qualities of water, that is, the far "left" end of the visible spectrum; i.e. red and orange are quickly filtered before reaching deep water. This leaves us with a situation where the colors that are left range from yellow to green. I think this is why you will find the chartreuse curly tail is a mainstay of the fishing industry. At depth, everything else looks gray or black to a bass.

[Raul]

Do we know fish can see colors ? yes we do know fish can see colors, the anatomy and hystiology of the eye tells us that fish can see colors, the receptors are there, the anatomical structures are there, and we know how much they can see colors based on the density, distribution, placement and type of receptors and tissues. It´s not subject to speculation, it´s science.

However, quantifying perception even though the anatomy/hystology and physiology is there is a tougher nut to crank, in other words, we do know they see colors what we don´t exactly know is how they see them. Let me put an example of this with a little story, my friend Luis is a very cool guy, he always dresses nicely, however he uses extensively strange color coordinations in his clothes, not that they looked bad, actually he looked good but in anybody else but him those color coordinations may look strange or plainly bad; there´s a say, the lion thinks that everybody is in the same condition he is, we tend to think that everybody else is like we are because we are the vast majority of the people, by we I mean we "normal" people, since "abnormal" people are scarce we mentally eliminate them, for example, lefties, 10% of the people are lefty, 90% are righty and most things are made for righties. The same applies for vision, the vast majority of us have normal color sight, but there´s a very small group of people that are color blind. They see colors but they don´t see them as we the vast mayority of people see them, the perception of colors in color "blind" people is different. The same applies to how other species can see colors and their shades.

So, how can you choose a color to fish ? well, don´t try too hard, my motto is: choose the color YOU LIKE, color only matters when it matters and in my experience very few times fish bite only one particular color. There are other, more important things you have to thake care of that have a more direct impact on your success than the color of your bait, we are taking: location & presentation.

Now if you come to think about it, people have favorites and there´s a huge number of reasons why a color becomes a favorite color, personally, I like pretty colored soft plastics, I have a bunch of colors and .......... 90% of my jigs are black , and there I am fishing a Culprit 7.5 inch ribbontail cotton candy worm and it has to be the cotton candy Culprit manufactures ( cuz that´s the one I like ) in the same lake at the same time, under the same conditions I´m fishing with a ...... black jig.

[Ebbetsguy]

Thanks Raul and Happy New Year to you

[Raul]

Same to you Dom.

[boloson]

Originally Posted by Ebbetsguy

Thanks Boloson: most of my fishing is night fishing , lately. My biggest producer number wise; 5/8 ounce jointed Jitterbug in BLACK!

i've never fished at night. always wanted to try. so are the fish more active at night?

ps: are u a cop?

Originally Posted by carolina-rig-01

But I can say that when I see a lot of shad activity in an area I generally get a lot more bites on a shad colored bait than on other colors.

u think bass targets a certain species or targets the color of a species because at that given time there were an abundance of that given species? i've dangled 2 different colors (same species) of live fish in front of a bass's face before & it would only go for the other & completely ignore the other. i guess color does play a role

[HarveysMinnow]

Originally Posted by carolina-rig-01

I would rather throw the wrong bait in the right spot than the right bait in the wrong spot.

C-rig, now there's a statement we can all benefit from! I'm thinking of adopting it as my motto.

Originally Posted by nofearengineer

Bass do have cone structures in their eyes, so they do have color vision. However, most research indicates that they do not see colors at the "right" end of the visible (to humans) spectrum; i.e, blue, indigo, and violet. (I know this would tend to shoot the "blue jig" theory in the pants, but it's not a 100% proven theory.)

Add to this the physical qualities of water, that is, the far "left" end of the visible spectrum; i.e. red and orange are quickly filtered before reaching deep water. This leaves us with a situation where the colors that are left range from yellow to green. I think this is why you will find the chartreuse curly tail is a mainstay of the fishing industry. At depth, everything else looks gray or black to a bass.

Thanks Brice, for your thoughts on this. I think back to years past, when the majority of fishermen around my area thought the purple worm was the magic answer to all fishing hopes, when in reality they would have been just as well off with black.

Originally Posted by Raul

Now if you come to think about it, people have favorites and there´s a huge number of reasons why a color becomes a favorite color, personally, I like pretty colored soft plastics, I have a bunch of colors and .......... 90% of my jigs are black , and there I am fishing a Culprit 7.5 inch ribbontail cotton candy worm and it has to be the cotton candy Culprit manufactures ( cuz that´s the one I like ) in the same lake at the same time, under the same conditions I´m fishing with a ...... black jig.

Thanks Raul, for amplifying one of the points I wanted to make -- that color favorites in lures are more important to the fisherman than they are to the fish. Not a thing wrong with that as far as I'm concerned.

Thanks to all others for their inputs as well. Dang, this is a great Forum!!

.

[Ebbetsguy]

Originally Posted by boloson

i've never fished at night. always wanted to try. so are the fish more active at night?

ps: are u a cop?

Check your PM's. actually in a way I played for the other team. I pm'd you as some fellas here get upset with my story

[keithdog]

I've read articles that make it very clear that bass do see colors. So knowing that, the "match the hatch" idea comes into play well. But so many variables need to be taken into consideration such as water clarity, and so on. What is going to be most visible color in any particular water condition. Night time is the time for black lures because black silhouettes better against the darkness better, so they say. But I've done well with white spinnerbaits at night which goes against that line of thought. Vibration might be the main key for night fishing. I believe bass primarily use their lateral line to locate prey in low light conditions. Now here is a story for ya, because I know fish CAN be very particular when choosing a color. I live near Michigan City Indiana which is right on Lake Michigan. There is a long pier that goes out to the lighthouse which offers good fishing. In the summer, Skamania Steelhead head into the creek there to head upstream to spawn. They gather out in front of the mouth, right off the pier. On a good day, the pier is lined with guys hauling in beautiful steelheads. When I started steelhead fishing there, I noticed EVERYONE was throwing bright orange spoons and nailing steelhead left and right all morning long. I had spoons in every color you could imagine EXCEPT orange. I know you know where I'm going with this. For two days, I never caught a steelhead. Unable to find any orange spoons, I went and spray painted mine orange. Sure enough, I started catching plenty of steelheads with the orange spoons. Why, who knows. However, the perch come in shallow that time of year, and if the perch are around so are the steelies. And perch do have an orange color to them. So while it may not always be the case, quite often, if you don't have that "right" color, your screwed. Oh, and yes, screwed is the proper terminolgy.

[Ebbetsguy]

I have lost count of the bass i have caught on Black Jitterbugs, at night., I can tell you that the 2 guys I fish most with chucked their Perch and Coach dog bugs, because they got tired of watching me. I use what I use, other will use what they feel best with, but I still haven't seen match the hatch theory proved for bass, even in your post Keith you talk about using a White Spinner bait with success, which I believe wholeheartedly , as I read your posts a lot b/c you have a lot of great information in them. Now Keith can you tell us what hatch that spinner bait is matching? Yes I am just SCREWING around, I concur this is the right technical term here.
I also agree with you that vibration plays an important part and the more i fish at night, I am leaning to it's the most important factor.

[boloson]

Originally Posted by Ebbetsguy

Check your PM's. actually in a way I played for the other team. I pm'd you as some fellas here get upset with my story

WOW. quite a life. i only asked because u said u had to re-certify in cpr & figured u were either an ambulance, fire or cop.

why would anyone get upset of your story? if anything i think it's noble what u do once a year

[Jim45498]

Years and years ago when I first started bass fishing I asked an experienced bass man what color should I be fishing with. He looked at me and smiled and said " If you want to consistantly catch bass you can use any color you want as long as it is black."
I think that is the best piece of information I have ever had when it comes to bass fishing.

[HarveysMinnow]

Originally Posted by keithdog

I've read articles that make it very clear that bass do see colors. So knowing that, the "match the hatch" idea comes into play well. But so many variables need to be taken into consideration such as water clarity, and so on. What is going to be most visible color in any particular water condition. Night time is the time for black lures because black silhouettes better against the darkness better, so they say. But I've done well with white spinnerbaits at night which goes against that line of thought. Vibration might be the main key for night fishing. I believe bass primarily use their lateral line to locate prey in low light conditions. Now here is a story for ya, because I know fish CAN be very particular when choosing a color. I live near Michigan City Indiana which is right on Lake Michigan. There is a long pier that goes out to the lighthouse which offers good fishing. In the summer, Skamania Steelhead head into the creek there to head upstream to spawn. They gather out in front of the mouth, right off the pier. On a good day, the pier is lined with guys hauling in beautiful steelheads. When I started steelhead fishing there, I noticed EVERYONE was throwing bright orange spoons and nailing steelhead left and right all morning long. I had spoons in every color you could imagine EXCEPT orange. I know you know where I'm going with this. For two days, I never caught a steelhead. Unable to find any orange spoons, I went and spray painted mine orange. Sure enough, I started catching plenty of steelheads with the orange spoons. Why, who knows. However, the perch come in shallow that time of year, and if the perch are around so are the steelies. And perch do have an orange color to them. So while it may not always be the case, quite often, if you don't have that "right" color, your screwed. Oh, and yes, screwed is the proper terminolgy.

What you have described, Keith, is certainly compelling evidence that Steelhead not only detect color but also make choices based on color. In a way it seems that such a feeding frenzy could almost be compared to "mob mentality". Maybe it fits the behavior patterns we discussed in the other thread on Bass packs. If that's true, maybe seeing orange was what triggered the frenzy with the Steelhead. I have to wonder though if Mr. Lunker Bass, being more of a solitary creature, is motivated more by other factors - shape, size, action, and possibly the perceived threat to his territory. Too bad we can't just ask him...but then that level of communication would tend to take away the challenge, wouldn't it?
/

[keithdog]

Originally Posted by Ebbetsguy

I still haven't seen match the hatch theory proved for bass, even in your post Keith you talk about using a White Spinner bait with success, which I believe wholeheartedly , as I read your posts a lot b/c you have a lot of great information in them. Now Keith can you tell us what hatch that spinner bait is matching?

Why, albino bluegills of course!

[Ebbetsguy]

You need some Dr.Phil Time

[keithdog]

Originally Posted by HarveysMinnow

What you have described, Keith, is certainly compelling evidence that Steelhead not only detect color but also make choices based on color. In a way it seems that such a feeding frenzy could almost be compared to "mob mentality". Maybe it fits the behavior patterns we discussed in the other thread on Bass packs. If that's true, maybe seeing orange was what triggered the frenzy with the Steelhead. I have to wonder though if Mr. Lunker Bass, being more of a solitary creature, is motivated more by other factors - shape, size, action, and possibly the perceived threat to his territory. Too bad we can't just ask him...but then that level of communication would tend to take away the challenge, wouldn't it?
/

Good point Harvey. A fishes overall behavior pattern might make a difference like you mentioned. A pack vs a solitary individual could make a big difference. What motivates any fishes predisposition will no doubt effect it's behavior and preferences. I know it does mine. Actually, watching any wildlife for any length of time at all one can observe this. I would guess the "mob mentality" feeding schools of preditor fish like bass would change the behavior compared to bass sitting off by themselves. Just the fact that they havn't joind in with the feeding pack shows we would need to fine tune our approach to catching that individual bass.

[Ebbetsguy]

Thanks to all , this is an excellent thread.

[George_Welcome]

Having the equipment to see color does not mean that the equipment actually functions. We humans have the equipment yet 1 in ten males has some form of color blindness. Perhaps bass do, and perhaps bass don't see color.

One day when a bass comes up and talks to you, you will know for sure. Of course I don't know if fishing is much fun in the after life.

[doc]

Originally Posted by George_Welcome

Of course I don't know if fishing is much fun in the after life.

I don't know about your afterlife, but my heaven is 80% water with nothing less than a 5 lber in it.

[HarveysMinnow]

Originally Posted by doc

I don't know about your afterlife, but my heaven is 80% water with nothing less than a 5 lber in it.

Sounds good to me, guys. But, as the song says, "when we've been there ten thousand years", will catching that 5-pounder have the same appeal as catching that first one had? I don't know, but I think we will all get to find out sooner or later.

.