dumb question

carolina-rig-01 · 04-02-09, 12:39 PM

ok i have a question that is probably gonna seem dumb and out of no where.

ok lets say my livewells hold 30 gallons of water. and lets say that water weighs 8lbs a gallon (just for a round figure). that means with my livewells full i have an extra 240 lbs in the boat. but lets say i add 20lbs of fish to the livewell, at first it would seem that i am now carrying 260 lbs. but does the weight of the fish add weight to the boat. i know that things weight less in water but i am not talking about that, lets just say the fish weight the same in the water as out of it because my question is since the fish are suspended in the water and not sitting on the bottom of the livewell am i carrying their weight? i am carrying the weight of the water that they are in but since they aren't touching the boat i don't think i would be carrying their weight, they would raise the water level in the livewell but the extra water would also drain out so anybody have any thoughts?

by the way i was just bored at work the other night and started wondering this out of the blue.

1/4 stick · 04-02-09, 12:45 PM

I have no clue. I do know someone on another board who just finished school as a physicist, I can post the question there and ask him if you'd like, he's good with the math and stuff.

jmartin · 04-02-09, 12:49 PM

c-rig you have to much free time at work. LOL you should really check out www.hulu.com those online shows can really pass the time. BTW I have no clue about your question.

Jerry

jasonfish320 · 04-02-09, 12:50 PM

I believe it's all about density and displacement...water actually changes weight at different temps.. http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/wa...ght-d_595.html

bcklash · 04-02-09, 01:29 PM

C-rig, you ever watched FLW weigh their fish -- they weigh them in a tub of water. Going by this I would say yes their weight will transfer to your boat.

I have heard some of their anglers complaining about weights being wrong. ( too high ).

Love of the Sport · 04-02-09, 01:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carolina-rig-01

ok i have a question that is probably gonna seem dumb and out of no where.

ok lets say my livewells hold 30 gallons of water. and lets say that water weighs 8lbs a gallon (just for a round figure). that means with my livewells full i have an extra 240 lbs in the boat. but lets say i add 20lbs of fish to the livewell, at first it would seem that i am now carrying 260 lbs. but does the weight of the fish add weight to the boat. i know that things weight less in water but i am not talking about that, lets just say the fish weight the same in the water as out of it because my question is since the fish are suspended in the water and not sitting on the bottom of the livewell am i carrying their weight? i am carrying the weight of the water that they are in but since they aren't touching the boat i don't think i would be carrying their weight, they would raise the water level in the livewell but the extra water would also drain out so anybody have any thoughts?

by the way i was just bored at work the other night and started wondering this out of the blue.

Yes you still add thier weight to the boat. The fish is suspended in the water and the water is resting against your boat.

MississippiBoy · 04-02-09, 01:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Love of the Sport

Yes you still add thier weight to the boat. The fish is suspended in the water and the water is resting against your boat.

Beat me to it...

Fishnngolfn · 04-02-09, 01:31 PM

Love of the Sport is correct. There is another way you could figure it out if you don't believe it. Get a 5 gallon bucket of water. Put it on a scale. Then add a 2 lb fish.

carolina-rig-01 · 04-02-09, 02:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fishnngolfn

Love of the Sport is correct. There is another way you could figure it out if you don't believe it. Get a 5 gallon bucket of water. Put it on a scale. Then add a 2 lb fish.

it's not the same though. a fish will raise the water level and in a 5 gallon bucket will weigh more. however in a livewell when the water raises it runs out the overfill drain so you are losing the wight of the water the fish displaces. i think the same thing goes for the flw weigh-in theory. one thing i don't understand about the flw weigh-ins is how they get accurate weights when a fish should weigh less in water than it would out of water.

i agree that we are thinking too hard about this but it was fun to get all the "smart" people at work scratching their heads over this question.

Fishnngolfn · 04-02-09, 03:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carolina-rig-01

it's not the same though. a fish will raise the water level and in a 5 gallon bucket will weigh more. however in a livewell when the water raises it runs out the overfill drain so you are losing the wight of the water the fish displaces. i think the same thing goes for the flw weigh-in theory. one thing i don't understand about the flw weigh-ins is how they get accurate weights when a fish should weigh less in water than it would out of water.

i agree that we are thinking too hard about this but it was fun to get all the "smart" people at work scratching their heads over this question.

Noone said that some of the water is lost through the overfill drain. It is really simple if you negate the loss of water to the overfill drain. It doesn't matter if the fish in the water or not. If you add 30 gallons of water to a livewell and then add 20 lbs of fish to the livewell, then you have added 30 gallons (~240 lbs of water) plus 20 lbs of fish. It doesn't matter whether the fish are floating or sinking or how much air is in their bladders. You have added 260 lbs of weight to your boat.

barkelypup · 04-06-09, 10:29 PM

Ok if you add the fish to the live well the weight of the fish will be added to total weight of the boat minus what ever water runs out the over flow. I'm not liquid pychologist and I didn't even stay at a Holliday Inn Express last night but weight is weight. There is no way to negate it unless you start throwing stuff over board. It's kinda like this. If you are standing on the back of the boat and pee over the side does the front of the boat sink lower in the water?

Quote:

Originally Posted by carolina-rig-01

it's not the same though. a fish will raise the water level and in a 5 gallon bucket will weigh more. however in a livewell when the water raises it runs out the overfill drain so you are losing the wight of the water the fish displaces. i think the same thing goes for the flw weigh-in theory. one thing i don't understand about the flw weigh-ins is how they get accurate weights when a fish should weigh less in water than it would out of water.

i agree that we are thinking too hard about this but it was fun to get all the "smart" people at work scratching their heads over this question.

Stinkies Daddy · 04-09-09, 05:39 PM

[quote=barkelypup;240508]Ok if you add the fish to the live well the weight of the fish will be added to total weight of the boat minus what ever water runs out the over flow. I'm not liquid pychologist and I didn't even stay at a Holliday Inn Express last night but weight is weight. There is no way to negate it unless you start throwing stuff over board. It's kinda like this. If you are standing on the back of the boat and pee over the side does the front of the boat sink lower in the water?[/quote]

Using this logic, if you paint a room in your house does it get smaller

jcw1503 · 04-02-09, 01:45 PM

Yes the weight is added to it but not the entire weight of the fish...because some of the water will be displaced.... so the entire weight of the water and the fish will not be carried but I have no clue how to figure how much water will displace.....

Stinkies Daddy · 04-06-09, 07:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jcw1503

Yes the weight is added to it but not the entire weight of the fish...because some of the water will be displaced.... so the entire weight of the water and the fish will not be carried but I have no clue how to figure how much water will displace.....

this is zactly on the money. a 5 lb rock is a 5lb rock weather its in the water or in a tree. the gravity in the water olny makes it seem lighter

carolina-rig-01 · 04-06-09, 02:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stinkies Daddy

this is zactly on the money. a 5 lb rock is a 5lb rock weather its in the water or in a tree. the gravity in the water olny makes it seem lighter

but the 5lb rock would sink to the bottom, thus touching the boat. a 5lb fish would be suspended in the water and not touching the boat so are you actually carrying the weight of the fish? not disagreeing, just wondering that's all. man it's funny how long this has been going and how many people are stating opinions on it.

Fishnngolfn · 04-06-09, 02:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carolina-rig-01

but the 5lb rock would sink to the bottom, thus touching the boat. a 5lb fish would be suspended in the water and not touching the boat so are you actually carrying the weight of the fish? not disagreeing, just wondering that's all. man it's funny how long this has been going and how many people are stating opinions on it.

The water is in fact supported some of the weight of the fish. However, the livewell is supported the water and the boat is supporting the livewell. SO the BOAT would see the additional 20 lbs of weight from the fish (excluding any water lost due to the overflow valve).

MississippiBoy · 04-06-09, 02:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fishnngolfn

<snip>additional 20 lbs of weight from the fish<snip>

There you go with that faulty 20 lbs supposition again...

Stinkies Daddy · 04-09-09, 05:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fishnngolfn

The water is in fact supported some of the weight of the fish. However, the livewell is supported the water and the boat is supporting the livewell. SO the BOAT would see the additional 20 lbs of weight from the fish (excluding any water lost due to the overflow valve).

Bingo, zactly, right on the money

cassidyta · 04-02-09, 01:48 PM

If you can get them to jump , then their weight is negated. The falling elevator threory....

aikenyounggun · 04-02-09, 02:03 PM

yeah they displace as much as they take up (volume.... actually how they teach it in elementary school) ..... but im not really sure if bass are denser than water.... i mean they do sink and all so i think they are ...... out they do maintain balance by an "air bladder".... so i think it does add weight but it also replaces a lot of weight when it displaces water..... ill ask my science teacher next period

MississippiBoy · 04-02-09, 02:30 PM

Good point, Aiken...although I think everybody is thinking WAAAAY too hard about this...

Put this in your pipe and smoke it...if the bass can change its depth by inflating/deflating its bladder, then it's changing its density. If it wants to sink, it deflates the bladder, making it denser than water. If it wants to rise, it will inflate the bladder, then it becomes less dense.

Sooooo, if you put a bass in your livewell, it may have its bladder fully inflated, and will weigh less than the water it displaces when you put it in. Then over the course of the day, it may deflate the bladder, and weigh more than the water it displaced.

THEREFORE....your boat may weight MORE with the bass in the livewell, OR it may weigh LESS...

The definitive answer is.....IT DEPENDS

lowrider · 04-02-09, 02:40 PM

wait, so the air, or lack of, inside a fish affects its weight? how much does air weigh? and how do you measure it?

MississippiBoy · 04-02-09, 02:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lowrider

wait, so the air, or lack of, inside a fish affects its weight? how much does air weigh? and how do you measure it?

Well, all the air above your head, all the way to outer space, weighs about 14.7 lbs per square inch. How big is a bass's swim bladder? There's some kind of formula for figuring up how much air weighs, but it depends heavily on temperature and humidy. I'm guessing humidity would be fairly high (we are talking about something that's underwater), but temperature varies.

JB · 04-02-09, 02:59 PM

this is all a ploy that once you figure its less weight it gives ya the "go ahead" to buy more tackle LOL

actually the water plus bass both add weight to the total rig, now go out there and fill up that livewell!

carolina-rig-01 · 04-02-09, 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JB

this is all a ploy that once you figure its less weight it gives ya the "go ahead" to buy more tackle LOL

actually the water plus bass both add weight to the total rig, now go out there and fill up that livewell!

i can't go fill up the livewell if i have to take all my tackle out of the boat to compensate for the weight hahaha. my wife actually thought the same thing, she said "is this your way to justify buying more tackle"? lmao.

04-02-09, 12:39 PM	#1
carolina-rig-01 BassFishin.Com Premier Elite Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Webb City, MO Posts: 6,387	dumb question ok i have a question that is probably gonna seem dumb and out of no where. ok lets say my livewells hold 30 gallons of water. and lets say that water weighs 8lbs a gallon (just for a round figure). that means with my livewells full i have an extra 240 lbs in the boat. but lets say i add 20lbs of fish to the livewell, at first it would seem that i am now carrying 260 lbs. but does the weight of the fish add weight to the boat. i know that things weight less in water but i am not talking about that, lets just say the fish weight the same in the water as out of it because my question is since the fish are suspended in the water and not sitting on the bottom of the livewell am i carrying their weight? i am carrying the weight of the water that they are in but since they aren't touching the boat i don't think i would be carrying their weight, they would raise the water level in the livewell but the extra water would also drain out so anybody have any thoughts? by the way i was just bored at work the other night and started wondering this out of the blue. __________________ You only live once. But if you do it right, once is enough.

04-02-09, 12:45 PM	#2
1/4 stick BassFishin.Com Super Veteran Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Fayetteville, N.C. Posts: 3,529	I have no clue. I do know someone on another board who just finished school as a physicist, I can post the question there and ask him if you'd like, he's good with the math and stuff. __________________ Just a redneck having fun. https://www.youtube.com/user/donaldvlogsify

04-02-09, 12:49 PM	#3
jmartin BassFishin.Com Active Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Bridgewater Va Posts: 304	c-rig you have to much free time at work. LOL you should really check out www.hulu.com those online shows can really pass the time. BTW I have no clue about your question. Jerry __________________ "Body Piercing by Springfield"

04-02-09, 12:50 PM	#4
jasonfish320 BassFishin.Com Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: MAINEIAC Posts: 585	I believe it's all about density and displacement...water actually changes weight at different temps.. http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/wa...ght-d_595.html __________________ "If at first you don't succeed; have another beer"

04-02-09, 01:29 PM	#5
bcklash BassFishin.Com Super Veteran Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Elliston, Va. Posts: 4,372	C-rig, you ever watched FLW weigh their fish -- they weigh them in a tub of water. Going by this I would say yes their weight will transfer to your boat. I have heard some of their anglers complaining about weights being wrong. ( too high ). __________________ The soap box, the ballot box, the jury box, and the cartridge box. keep us free:

04-02-09, 01:31 PM	#8
Fishnngolfn BassFishin.Com Super Veteran Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 1,523	Love of the Sport is correct. There is another way you could figure it out if you don't believe it. Get a 5 gallon bucket of water. Put it on a scale. Then add a 2 lb fish.

04-09-09, 05:39 PM	#12
Stinkies Daddy BassFishin.Com Active Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Pea Ridge, Arkansas Posts: 118	[quote=barkelypup;240508]Ok if you add the fish to the live well the weight of the fish will be added to total weight of the boat minus what ever water runs out the over flow. I'm not liquid pychologist and I didn't even stay at a Holliday Inn Express last night but weight is weight. There is no way to negate it unless you start throwing stuff over board. It's kinda like this. If you are standing on the back of the boat and pee over the side does the front of the boat sink lower in the water?[/quote] Using this logic, if you paint a room in your house does it get smaller __________________ Stinkies Daddy

04-02-09, 01:45 PM	#13
jcw1503 BassFishin.Com Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: South Carolina Posts: 617	Yes the weight is added to it but not the entire weight of the fish...because some of the water will be displaced.... so the entire weight of the water and the fish will not be carried but I have no clue how to figure how much water will displace..... __________________ The charm of fishing is that it is the pursuit of what is elusive yet attainable, a perpetual series of occasions for hope....

04-02-09, 01:48 PM	#19
cassidyta BassFishin.Com Super Veteran Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 2,928	If you can get them to jump , then their weight is negated. The falling elevator threory.... __________________ If you have ever wondered if you should retie, the answer is yes.

04-02-09, 02:03 PM	#20
aikenyounggun BassFishin.Com Super Veteran Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: aiken, SC Posts: 2,051	yeah they displace as much as they take up (volume.... actually how they teach it in elementary school) ..... but im not really sure if bass are denser than water.... i mean they do sink and all so i think they are ...... out they do maintain balance by an "air bladder".... so i think it does add weight but it also replaces a lot of weight when it displaces water..... ill ask my science teacher next period __________________ <>< Rather be Fishing ><>

04-02-09, 02:30 PM	#21
MississippiBoy BassFishin.Com Super Veteran Join Date: May 2007 Location: Ridgeland MS Posts: 3,923	Good point, Aiken...although I think everybody is thinking WAAAAY too hard about this... Put this in your pipe and smoke it...if the bass can change its depth by inflating/deflating its bladder, then it's changing its density. If it wants to sink, it deflates the bladder, making it denser than water. If it wants to rise, it will inflate the bladder, then it becomes less dense. Sooooo, if you put a bass in your livewell, it may have its bladder fully inflated, and will weigh less than the water it displaces when you put it in. Then over the course of the day, it may deflate the bladder, and weigh more than the water it displaced. THEREFORE....your boat may weight MORE with the bass in the livewell, OR it may weigh LESS... The definitive answer is.....IT DEPENDS __________________ I smell smoke, and I hear sirens. Do you think that's a problem?

04-02-09, 02:40 PM	#22
lowrider BassFishin.Com Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: South Arkansas Posts: 937	wait, so the air, or lack of, inside a fish affects its weight? how much does air weigh? and how do you measure it?

04-02-09, 02:59 PM	#24
JB BassFishin.Com Premier Elite Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 8,655	this is all a ploy that once you figure its less weight it gives ya the "go ahead" to buy more tackle LOL actually the water plus bass both add weight to the total rig, now go out there and fill up that livewell!

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