building a house

[carolina-rig-01]

Britney and I have been house shopping for a year now and it is starting to burn us out. We have been very patient and picky in our quest for a new home. We know what we want and honestly aren't willing to settle for less, this is the place that we plan on raising our family and living in for a long time so it has to be a house that we are both very comfortable in. In the year of looking we found two houses that we absolutley loved and one ended up being too close to a flood zone and the other we got screwed out of by a crooked real estate agent. We have continued to look at way more houses than I can count and just haven't had "that feeling" about any of them. There wasn't many new houses coming on the market and after our tornado left 6,000 families looking for new housing the market got a lot tougher and a lot tighter for buyers. We have come to the conclusion that in order to get what we want in a timely manner we are just going to have to build a house. We found some land that we really like and it's a long ways out of town but is still actually a very reasonable drive to work for both of us and is only a mile or so from a major road that will be cleared off in ice and snow which is very important to me considering Britney drives with Lake in her truck a lot and I worry a lot lol. So my question is to those who have had houses built in the past. Is it as bad as everyone says it is? I mean how big of a headache is it on a scale of 1-10 lol. There is a lot of stuff that I can do myself to save some money but considering my work schedule and being on something of a time frame I will probably keep my hands out of it for the most part other than maybe laying some hardwoods, building a deck, and small stuff here and there. We found a contractor that we are going to meet with asap and discuss they details. We really don't know anything about this contractor but we are getting some refrences and the address to some of his houses that we can check out. We are still somewhat up in the air about taking on this project and if something did come on the market we would possibly just buy a house but building is becoming more likely. So lets hear some advice from experience.

[nofearengineer]

Kory, I haven't had a house built, but as I have engineered multi-million dollar projects, I hope you take my advice for what it's worth.

Two things are the most helpful:

1. Do you know how houses are built? Know how contractors cut corners, and how they hide things.

2. Maintain an active presence on the site. This will help with no. 1. It will also help with the contractor not being able to give you some pathetic excuses why things aren't moving as fast as they should.

I hope you get a good contractor. There are a lot of them out there. There are also a lot of a-holes who will milk you dry on change orders if you let them. Be sure you know exactly what you are getting as far as materials and finishes long before they break ground. You do not want to be forced to cheap out on the last items to be installed because the guy already broke your budget by "not noticing" that the stairs would have to be moved, or that the bedroom was 2 square feet too small by code until it was already built.

Okay...I'm done LOL.

[Top Tiger]

One thing to think of, be sure that your contractor has experience with the construction technique that you're planning to use. Concrete block, stick built w/ wood siding etc. Check out the houses he's built using whatever materials that you decide on. What you're planning can be an extremely rewarding event or a total nightmare. Remember the 6 P's. Proper Planning Prevents Piss Poor Performance. If the job is done right you'll have not just a house to be proud of but you'll have a home. There is a difference.

[carolina-rig-01]

Originally Posted by nofearengineer

Kory, I haven't had a house built, but as I have engineered multi-million dollar projects, I hope you take my advice for what it's worth.

Two things are the most helpful:

1. Do you know how houses are built? Know how contractors cut corners, and how they hide things.

2. Maintain an active presence on the site. This will help with no. 1. It will also help with the contractor not being able to give you some pathetic excuses why things aren't moving as fast as they should.

I hope you get a good contractor. There are a lot of them out there. There are also a lot of a-holes who will milk you dry on change orders if you let them. Be sure you know exactly what you are getting as far as materials and finishes long before they break ground. You do not want to be forced to cheap out on the last items to be installed because the guy already broke your budget by "not noticing" that the stairs would have to be moved, or that the bedroom was 2 square feet too small by code until it was already built.

Okay...I'm done LOL.

I am pretty familiar with building as I worked in the construction field for several years. I have never built a house from the ground up but have done all of it on different jobs if that makes sense. One thing we planned on is going with cheaper finish items up front so we could replace them down the road when time and money allows. These will be small things like light fixtures and small stuff like that. I think this is a good idea too because it would give us a little time to live in the house and get an idea of how we want the decor to flow. But I know better than to skimp on the stuff that really matters like lumber, windows, flooring, ect. As for #2 I am sure that he will have Britney on his tail daily not only checking up on his work but also making sure that they clean up the property every day because we are very big on keeping stuff clean.

Originally Posted by Top Tiger

One thing to think of, be sure that your contractor has experience with the construction technique that you're planning to use. Concrete block, stick built w/ wood siding etc. Check out the houses he's built using whatever materials that you decide on. What you're planning can be an extremely rewarding event or a total nightmare. Remember the 6 P's. Proper Planning Prevents Piss Poor Performance. If the job is done right you'll have not just a house to be proud of but you'll have a home. There is a difference.

The contractor has a bunch of his own floor plans that we could go with if we want to but we already have a pretty good idea what we want because we absolutley love the house that we got screwed out of and we are going to build it almost exactly like it only with a few personal touches that are minor things like adding a bar in the kitchen and an exterior door off the master bedroom that goes out to the deck/hot tub. This floor plan is nothing crazy and is really a fairly basic house as far as building goes so I am sure that we will be fine there. The big thing is looking at his previous work and talking to some of his customers to make sure his work is up to par.

I appreciate the info fellas.

[pro reel]

Kory,most contractors are just paper pushers. They pull the permits and organize the sub contractors. Some do have a full time staff that does some of the small items such as you mentioned and then does a site clean up to get it move in ready. That being said, they are only as good as the current subs they are using. I would never hire a contractor, but my dad and I have done this many times, so it would be daunting to others. We pull our own permit and then hire our own subs to do each phase of work. If we don't like something when it's done, that sub doesn't get paid until it's right. I'ts a lot harder to get money from a bank when you are your own contractor, they need to know you and know that you will get it done, or if a private lender will front the money, then you just get the full mortgage when the home is finished. A contractor will normally make about 30% profit over what the subs built the house for, so we save at least that, but then we also do a lot of the work ourselves, such as siding, cabinets, fixtures, tile and trim. I'm a damn good trim carpenter so I would not let anyone else do that. The process takes a little longer, but it's worth it in the end. If thats above your interestt level, then shop around for contractors that will let you be involved every step of the way. Yea, they have places they get the materials from and get good prices, but you can be involved in picking the materials. One thing that I would never, never do is build a new house with 2X4 outside walls. They are energy ineficient, and weak. 99% of all new homes are built with 2X4 out walls. Any home plan can be converted to 2X6 outside walls. The 2X6 studs only need to be on 24 inch centyers and then you have room for almost twice the insulation. Windows and doors just will have a deeper set look to the trim work, but it looks good. The house will be way more sturdy and won't develop wind creaks like most houses do. The energy savings is unbelievavble. The initial cost is not very much and you save it back in a year or less. I could write a book about everything you should think about, but you should just give me a call when you get closer. I am currently a SR. engineering tech for Sedgwick County, so I perform inspection work or major projects. I have several tips you will want to talk about before anyone places any concrete for the basement, foundation floors, etc. Little things that they all skip can make a huge difference in the life of concrete.

[carolina-rig-01]

Originally Posted by pro reel

Kory,most contractors are just paper pushers. They pull the permits and organize the sub contractors. Some do have a full time staff that does some of the small items such as you mentioned and then does a site clean up to get it move in ready. That being said, they are only as good as the current subs they are using. I would never hire a contractor, but my dad and I have done this many times, so it would be daunting to others. We pull our own permit and then hire our own subs to do each phase of work. If we don't like something when it's done, that sub doesn't get paid until it's right. I'ts a lot harder to get money from a bank when you are your own contractor, they need to know you and know that you will get it done, or if a private lender will front the money, then you just get the full mortgage when the home is finished. A contractor will normally make about 30% profit over what the subs built the house for, so we save at least that, but then we also do a lot of the work ourselves, such as siding, cabinets, fixtures, tile and trim. I'm a damn good trim carpenter so I would not let anyone else do that. The process takes a little longer, but it's worth it in the end. If thats above your interestt level, then shop around for contractors that will let you be involved every step of the way. Yea, they have places they get the materials from and get good prices, but you can be involved in picking the materials. One thing that I would never, never do is build a new house with 2X4 outside walls. They are energy ineficient, and weak. 99% of all new homes are built with 2X4 out walls. Any home plan can be converted to 2X6 outside walls. The 2X6 studs only need to be on 24 inch centyers and then you have room for almost twice the insulation. Windows and doors just will have a deeper set look to the trim work, but it looks good. The house will be way more sturdy and won't develop wind creaks like most houses do. The energy savings is unbelievavble. The initial cost is not very much and you save it back in a year or less. I could write a book about everything you should think about, but you should just give me a call when you get closer. I am currently a SR. engineering tech for Sedgwick County, so I perform inspection work or major projects. I have several tips you will want to talk about before anyone places any concrete for the basement, foundation floors, etc. Little things that they all skip can make a huge difference in the life of concrete.

Thanks Kevin. Good info there, I will probably holler at you when the time comes.

[Embrey]

Originally Posted by pro reel

Kory,most contractors are just paper pushers. They pull the permits and organize the sub contractors. Some do have a full time staff that does some of the small items such as you mentioned and then does a site clean up to get it move in ready. That being said, they are only as good as the current subs they are using. I would never hire a contractor, but my dad and I have done this many times, so it would be daunting to others. We pull our own permit and then hire our own subs to do each phase of work. If we don't like something when it's done, that sub doesn't get paid until it's right. I'ts a lot harder to get money from a bank when you are your own contractor, they need to know you and know that you will get it done, or if a private lender will front the money, then you just get the full mortgage when the home is finished. A contractor will normally make about 30% profit over what the subs built the house for, so we save at least that, but then we also do a lot of the work ourselves, such as siding, cabinets, fixtures, tile and trim. I'm a damn good trim carpenter so I would not let anyone else do that. The process takes a little longer, but it's worth it in the end. If thats above your interestt level, then shop around for contractors that will let you be involved every step of the way. Yea, they have places they get the materials from and get good prices, but you can be involved in picking the materials. One thing that I would never, never do is build a new house with 2X4 outside walls. They are energy ineficient, and weak. 99% of all new homes are built with 2X4 out walls. Any home plan can be converted to 2X6 outside walls. The 2X6 studs only need to be on 24 inch centyers and then you have room for almost twice the insulation. Windows and doors just will have a deeper set look to the trim work, but it looks good. The house will be way more sturdy and won't develop wind creaks like most houses do. The energy savings is unbelievavble. The initial cost is not very much and you save it back in a year or less. I could write a book about everything you should think about, but you should just give me a call when you get closer. I am currently a SR. engineering tech for Sedgwick County, so I perform inspection work or major projects. I have several tips you will want to talk about before anyone places any concrete for the basement, foundation floors, etc. Little things that they all skip can make a huge difference in the life of concrete.

i pour foundations for a living. what little things do i skip exactly? lol

[nofearengineer]

Kevin, it does my heart good to hear someone say "place" concrete.

[pro reel]

Originally Posted by Embrey

i pour foundations for a living. what little things do i skip exactly? lol

Ok, rephrase they should be most. But with my experience around here, it's all of them if they are not being tested.

Air in concrete. Unless you live in an area where it never freezes, any concrete exposed to the elements should have an air entraining admixture included. Microscopic air bubbles helps to prevent scaling of concrete finishes. If you ask most concrete finishers about this they have no idea what you are talking about.

Cure protection. All concrete regardless of area or aplication needs to be protected from evaporation. We call it keeping it in cure for the cure period. The contractor can use liquid wax based cure compounds or wet burlap and plastic. Failure to do this results in evaporation cracking. I seldom see any foundation contractors use any cure protection on exposed concrete.

Reinforcement. One of the biggest things we fight with contractors on, and it never ends, is wire reinforcment. They will get it all in place, but as soon as the truck is there you will see several guys walking in the mud and no one is pulling the wire up into the middle 1/3rd of the slab. What good is the wire if it's under the concrete?

Placement technique. I can't tell you how many jobs I shut down due to poor placement practices. One major offence is dropping concrete into forms without the use of a drop chute. Concrete that falls more than a few feet will segregate. I also quite often see them use the truck chute to place concrete but they dump it with excessive force into area's that were built up with sand and you can watch the sand being washed into the mix.

Temperature requirments. Unless they are on state or federal jobs, many contractors don't even know that concrete has temperature min amd max placement requirments.

Wow, I almost forgot the most common with non inspection jobs. Adding water. Concrete mix designs are exact formulas for strength and curing expectations. Slump is the measurment of the fluidity of concrete. When a truck brings the concrete to the site, it was ordered at a certain slump. The concrte in the truck should be close to that slump. They may have withheld some water from the mix to be able to add back to get an exact slump, but unless the ticket indicates this, you can't add water to the mix without drastically reducing the strength. Slump at the plant is not set by adding or subtracting water, it's set with an exact formula of components, retarders, acceleraters and plasticisors. Adding water at the pour is a no no, unless it was withheld and then you can only add the amount that was witheld.

[nofearengineer]

Wow, Kevin. I had no idea you were so knowledgeable about concrete. I'm a rare dog for a sparky, since I had to learn all about it when building my concrete canoes. I spec 3000 psi concrete for all of my Electrical work (equipment bases and duct banks) and I can affirm that adding water to it is a NO NO. It's not a cake mix. There are chemical reactions going on. Either get it to the job site on time or you'd better keep an extra bag of sugar in your truck.

[pro reel]

Originally Posted by nofearengineer

Wow, Kevin. I had no idea you were so knowledgeable about concrete. I'm a rare dog for a sparky, since I had to learn all about it when building my concrete canoes. I spec 3000 psi concrete for all of my Electrical work (equipment bases and duct banks) and I can affirm that adding water to it is a NO NO. It's not a cake mix. There are chemical reactions going on. Either get it to the job site on time or you'd better keep an extra bag of sugar in your truck.

Bryce, my day job is a Sr. Engineering technician for Sedgwick Co. Ks. I administer contracts and oversee road and bridge construction projects from start to finish. I'm Kdot and ACI certified in concrete placement and strength testing.

[bamabassman]

kory, kevin and bryce BOTH hit on things oyu need ot look out for. as oyu know, we jsut built a new house. and being the son of a structurel detailer and draftesman (my father0, and having worked on or built many houses in my past....one thing is really CLEAR to me.

FIND someone you TRUST. have blueprints drawn up and go over each and every detail. if the perosn doing such prints get supset and acts like they know more than you, FIRE THEM. it's like we say here, no such thing as a stupid question, only a stupid answer. if YOU think there is someting not right. ask themn to explain it to you. kevin knows what he is doing i can tell. and bryce is a CERTIFIED engineer. so these guys can REALLY help youout. now me....i'm jsut a fella who has had years of experience doing some actual work on framing and general overseeing really. i know what is good and bad about building a house. our new house is the hosue we DREAMED of. but after finishing it, there are a couple of things we wished we had done differently. nothing major, minor really.
going over budget is most likely gonna happen after you start ont he frameing and finishing part. happens everytime. well MOST everytime. there will be someting like molding that you THOUGHT oyu wanted and then decided on someothing else. but what i think bryce and kevin are truly talking aobut is the foundation and frame work as to being "over budget", plese guys correct me if i am worng ok? i ain't wanting to stpe on no toes here.
i love the house building business. i love watching it go from ground to finished. if the market was good and i could....i would get into being a contractor. headaches and all. lol!


here is an idea for you and britney to do. sit down with a pad and pen/pencil. make a list of what oyu WANT in oyur house. write it down. go over it and over it. then think aobut what is NEEDED instead of what oyu WANT. go over it again and again. then make a sketch of what oyu want it to look like. doesn't have to be perfect or nothing. sketch the outside too. this will give oyu a fell of how oyu want it to look, the style of your house. i do sketches all the time and make different floorplans. i take them to my dad and ask what he thins aobut it. he will then tell me what is wrong with it and what is right about it.

i plan to build ONE more house, our retirement home. the one we want on or overlooking the lake. this next house is the one i want to live out my days in. every house i have done has been one to resale so far. so take that into consideration too. oyu want ahouse that is comfortable for oyur family NOW, but others will want it when oyu decide to move on.
be sure to check on codes and such for the area you are building too. some places have STRICT ristrictions on what oyu can and cannot have in that area or neighborhood. things like fences ahve to be either chainlink or wood, no garage doors facing the road, no more than a 2 car garage. these things play alot into wheather or not it is going to be a place you guys want to live in. can oyu believe that there are neighborhoods that DON'T allow a boat to be parked in front of the garage? OUTRAGIOUS in my opion. but it's true.
as for the headach of building, yes it CAN be a headache, but i believe it is well worth it to get the HOME oyu truly want. if oyu get a GOOD builder, it can be a breeze. check out the builder throughly. before decideing on one.

[nofearengineer]

Kory,

I totally forgot about a piece of web software that I found to be a lot of fun.

http://floorplanner.com/

It's free.

At the very least, you and Brit can sit around designing your dream house with it. You don't have to be an Architect or Engineer.

Best case, you can take pictures of the plans with you when you talk with a contractor to give him an idea of what you want, rather than just tell him.

[Embrey]

Originally Posted by pro reel

Ok, rephrase they should be most. But with my experience around here, it's all of them if they are not being tested.

Air in concrete. Unless you live in an area where it never freezes, any concrete exposed to the elements should have an air entraining admixture included. Microscopic air bubbles helps to prevent scaling of concrete finishes. If you ask most concrete finishers about this they have no idea what you are talking about.

Cure protection. All concrete regardless of area or aplication needs to be protected from evaporation. We call it keeping it in cure for the cure period. The contractor can use liquid wax based cure compounds or wet burlap and plastic. Failure to do this results in evaporation cracking. I seldom see any foundation contractors use any cure protection on exposed concrete.

Reinforcement. One of the biggest things we fight with contractors on, and it never ends, is wire reinforcment. They will get it all in place, but as soon as the truck is there you will see several guys walking in the mud and no one is pulling the wire up into the middle 1/3rd of the slab. What good is the wire if it's under the concrete?

Placement technique. I can't tell you how many jobs I shut down due to poor placement practices. One major offence is dropping concrete into forms without the use of a drop chute. Concrete that falls more than a few feet will segregate. I also quite often see them use the truck chute to place concrete but they dump it with excessive force into area's that were built up with sand and you can watch the sand being washed into the mix.

Temperature requirments. Unless they are on state or federal jobs, many contractors don't even know that concrete has temperature min amd max placement requirments.

Wow, I almost forgot the most common with non inspection jobs. Adding water. Concrete mix designs are exact formulas for strength and curing expectations. Slump is the measurment of the fluidity of concrete. When a truck brings the concrete to the site, it was ordered at a certain slump. The concrte in the truck should be close to that slump. They may have withheld some water from the mix to be able to add back to get an exact slump, but unless the ticket indicates this, you can't add water to the mix without drastically reducing the strength. Slump at the plant is not set by adding or subtracting water, it's set with an exact formula of components, retarders, acceleraters and plasticisors. Adding water at the pour is a no no, unless it was withheld and then you can only add the amount that was witheld.

im not here to argue, but most engineers say all this stuff about water, but the truth is, in real life it doesnt work that way. if it shows up too dry to run out of the chute, good luck with pouring it and getting any results out of it. i do use air in exposed pours, and use steel fibers in basment slabs.

[pro reel]

Sorry Embrey, I'm not trying to offend anyone, just giving Kory some facts to be aware of. The truth is, I'm not an engineer and don't have anything to do with concrete design or writing of specs. I work in the real world every day supervising concrete pours and performing verification tests. If concrete shows up to dry to use, then it's already ruined, we reject it and send the truck back. That would be on the plant or the driver and the project owner or contractor isn't going to pay for that load. If we were to allow a contractor to just add extra water then the owner of the project isn't getting what they speced and paid for, they would be getting a considerably weaker and less durable product. You hear about things like that all the time, what caused that bridge to fall down or that road to go to crap before it's time? Poor workmanship and inferior components, thats what. When a contractor scheduales a concrete pour, he is responsible for having everything ready and enough personel on site to get the concrete placed in the correct amount of time. The contractor has several tools availabe to him to calculate the effects of temperature, wind speed, humidity, and evaporation. he should use those tools to determine an optimum time to place the concrete and if any additives such as plas or retarder should be used. The concrete plant has the responsibility to mix the concrete to the design specs and deliver it in a timley manor. If the contractor scheduales a pour during hot temperatures, he needs to be sure that the truck can get there in a short amount of time and get it placed and finished within the apropriate time period for those temps. What they can't be allowed to do is to simply add water to thin the mix out to make it runny after initial set has already started to occur. The sad fact is that this happens all the time as most contractors are not working under any guidlines other than thier own. Buyer beware and be eduacted.

[Embrey]

well, on paper thats all neat, but if i got 4 trucks in a wall and its hot and the 5th one needs 5 gallons in it make it workable,thats whats gonna happen. it has never hurt a thing in mine or my dads lifetime,but sending that truck back and waiting for another and letting that wall set up before it gets back is just promising a cold joint. its a dang if you ,dang if you dont situation. im not talking about making it all runny. theres a difference.

[pro reel]

Originally Posted by Embrey

well, on paper thats all neat, but if i got 4 trucks in a wall and its hot and the 5th one needs 5 gallons in it make it workable,thats whats gonna happen. it has never hurt a thing in mine or my dads lifetime,but sending that truck back and waiting for another and letting that wall set up before it gets back is just promising a cold joint. its a dang if you ,dang if you dont situation. im not talking about making it all runny. theres a difference.

Big difference between 5 gallons and what I see happen most of the time. As I said in the first post, look at the ticket, they probably held back 1 to 2 gals. per CU. YD. If they did, then you can add that back if it needs it.
How would you know if it ever hurt anything or not? Have you added more water than was speced and then examed that section of a wall 5 to 10 years later to see if it formed any cracks?
Anyway. I don't care what you do as long as you don't do it on one of my jobs or on a job for someone I know. Again, I'm just giving Kory the facts to be aware of. What I would mostly be concerned with is that they don't use excessive amounts of water, that they use Cure protection after the pour, that they don't remove the forms to early and as you stated, that they don't form a cold joint by poor planning such as placing concrete while it's hot out.

[Embrey]

i have looked at many of my jobs, 5,10 or even 15 or more years later, when back doing other work they wanted done. no issues. theres a difference between excessive, and needed.if you make the stuff like water, then obviously thats bad.

[nofearengineer]

Try building a canoe out of concrete.

[Embrey]

Originally Posted by nofearengineer

Try building a canoe out of concrete.

explain...cause that sounds like a terrible idea!lol

[bamabassman]

it's been done embry, MIT guys did it. it floated too.



let's not steal from KORY'S thread guys. not wanting to be a mother hen or nothing, but let's get back to focusing on what kory is wanting to know ok?

[carolina-rig-01]

Originally Posted by bamabassman

kory, kevin and bryce BOTH hit on things oyu need ot look out for. as oyu know, we jsut built a new house. and being the son of a structurel detailer and draftesman (my father0, and having worked on or built many houses in my past....one thing is really CLEAR to me.

FIND someone you TRUST. have blueprints drawn up and go over each and every detail. if the perosn doing such prints get supset and acts like they know more than you, FIRE THEM. it's like we say here, no such thing as a stupid question, only a stupid answer. if YOU think there is someting not right. ask themn to explain it to you. kevin knows what he is doing i can tell. and bryce is a CERTIFIED engineer. so these guys can REALLY help youout. now me....i'm jsut a fella who has had years of experience doing some actual work on framing and general overseeing really. i know what is good and bad about building a house. our new house is the hosue we DREAMED of. but after finishing it, there are a couple of things we wished we had done differently. nothing major, minor really.
going over budget is most likely gonna happen after you start ont he frameing and finishing part. happens everytime. well MOST everytime. there will be someting like molding that you THOUGHT oyu wanted and then decided on someothing else. but what i think bryce and kevin are truly talking aobut is the foundation and frame work as to being "over budget", plese guys correct me if i am worng ok? i ain't wanting to stpe on no toes here.
i love the house building business. i love watching it go from ground to finished. if the market was good and i could....i would get into being a contractor. headaches and all. lol!


here is an idea for you and britney to do. sit down with a pad and pen/pencil. make a list of what oyu WANT in oyur house. write it down. go over it and over it. then think aobut what is NEEDED instead of what oyu WANT. go over it again and again. then make a sketch of what oyu want it to look like. doesn't have to be perfect or nothing. sketch the outside too. this will give oyu a fell of how oyu want it to look, the style of your house. i do sketches all the time and make different floorplans. i take them to my dad and ask what he thins aobut it. he will then tell me what is wrong with it and what is right about it.

i plan to build ONE more house, our retirement home. the one we want on or overlooking the lake. this next house is the one i want to live out my days in. every house i have done has been one to resale so far. so take that into consideration too. oyu want ahouse that is comfortable for oyur family NOW, but others will want it when oyu decide to move on.
be sure to check on codes and such for the area you are building too. some places have STRICT ristrictions on what oyu can and cannot have in that area or neighborhood. things like fences ahve to be either chainlink or wood, no garage doors facing the road, no more than a 2 car garage. these things play alot into wheather or not it is going to be a place you guys want to live in. can oyu believe that there are neighborhoods that DON'T allow a boat to be parked in front of the garage? OUTRAGIOUS in my opion. but it's true.
as for the headach of building, yes it CAN be a headache, but i believe it is well worth it to get the HOME oyu truly want. if oyu get a GOOD builder, it can be a breeze. check out the builder throughly. before decideing on one.

Britney and I have set around just about every night for the last year or so talking about our must haves and like to haves. We are on the same page as far as what we want goes. That is part of the problem lol, we know what we want and aren't willing to settle for anything less and that is what lead us to where we are today. But that's ok because an investment of this size should make you happy.

Originally Posted by nofearengineer

Kory,

I totally forgot about a piece of web software that I found to be a lot of fun.

http://floorplanner.com/

It's free.

At the very least, you and Brit can sit around designing your dream house with it. You don't have to be an Architect or Engineer.

Best case, you can take pictures of the plans with you when you talk with a contractor to give him an idea of what you want, rather than just tell him.

Thanks for that site Bryce. We will be playing on that for sure.

Originally Posted by pro reel

Ok, rephrase they should be most. But with my experience around here, it's all of them if they are not being tested.

Air in concrete. Unless you live in an area where it never freezes, any concrete exposed to the elements should have an air entraining admixture included. Microscopic air bubbles helps to prevent scaling of concrete finishes. If you ask most concrete finishers about this they have no idea what you are talking about.

Cure protection. All concrete regardless of area or aplication needs to be protected from evaporation. We call it keeping it in cure for the cure period. The contractor can use liquid wax based cure compounds or wet burlap and plastic. Failure to do this results in evaporation cracking. I seldom see any foundation contractors use any cure protection on exposed concrete.

Reinforcement. One of the biggest things we fight with contractors on, and it never ends, is wire reinforcment. They will get it all in place, but as soon as the truck is there you will see several guys walking in the mud and no one is pulling the wire up into the middle 1/3rd of the slab. What good is the wire if it's under the concrete?

Placement technique. I can't tell you how many jobs I shut down due to poor placement practices. One major offence is dropping concrete into forms without the use of a drop chute. Concrete that falls more than a few feet will segregate. I also quite often see them use the truck chute to place concrete but they dump it with excessive force into area's that were built up with sand and you can watch the sand being washed into the mix.

Temperature requirments. Unless they are on state or federal jobs, many contractors don't even know that concrete has temperature min amd max placement requirments.

Wow, I almost forgot the most common with non inspection jobs. Adding water. Concrete mix designs are exact formulas for strength and curing expectations. Slump is the measurment of the fluidity of concrete. When a truck brings the concrete to the site, it was ordered at a certain slump. The concrte in the truck should be close to that slump. They may have withheld some water from the mix to be able to add back to get an exact slump, but unless the ticket indicates this, you can't add water to the mix without drastically reducing the strength. Slump at the plant is not set by adding or subtracting water, it's set with an exact formula of components, retarders, acceleraters and plasticisors. Adding water at the pour is a no no, unless it was withheld and then you can only add the amount that was witheld.

I poured concrete for a few years right out of high school. We did some really big pours and some really cool stuff. I consider myself a pretty good hand at pouring and finishing concrete and yet I had no knowledge of all this stuff you mentioned lol.

You guys are awesome.

[Abbeysdad]

In 1979 I/we built a Ridge home. Ridge Homes was part of the Evans Corporation, and a sister company of Grossman's Lumber. You pick a model (we chose a left handed Caldwell - a two story, three bedroom, 1 3/4 bath).
On land you purchase separately, they build the foundation and shell. From the outside, it looks like a finished home, from the inside, it's all just bare studs. A truck arrives that you unload with all the finish building materials.
You do (or sub-contract) the plumbing, electrical, insulation, sub-floor, sheet rock, trim...
I sub'ed out the rough electrical to a fellow I knew from work, but we did all the rest ourselves! (oh, I hired a fellow to drill the well, another for the pump/pressure tank and someone else to install the septic system...."green acres is the place for me"...<hehe>)

I worked a 4 on / 4 off 12 hr work schedule which helped as on my 4 days off, I worked from dawn till dusk on the house. It was A LOT of work.

Now in theory, my effort was supposed to equate to about $10k in sweat equity. How this worked (since banks won't loan money to 'regular' people for unfinished homes) is that they setup a temporary 1 year loan to allow finishing the home, then you obtain a regular mortgage. The world went crazy that year. When we started building, interest rates were at 9%. When we were done, we were 'lucky' to get a variable 30 year at 14.5% !!! Needless to say, a refinance a few years later, resulted in a much better deal.
That aside, and investing a ton of time in my life, working with limited tools and very little extra money as 'out of pocket' was a killer, the house turned out pretty decent. I've had bragging rights for all these years.
I think the biggest thing was the shocked approval of my dad. He wasn't especially handy. I remember he happened to stop by after I had roughed in the plumbing and was about to do a leak test. There were no leaks. He left shaking his head saying, "I'll be damned". When the house was all finished, he said "you did a really good job, I didn't know you had it in you." Perhaps tongue in cheek praise, but praise non the less.
Building a house this way AND working a full time job is something for a naive 25 year old, but not something I'd do today.
I don't even know if there are outfits like Ridge and Miles homes that do this kind of build today. I remember hearing back then that a lot of shells were built and not finished due to skills and money and time... It's a lot of work or money to finish a home.
On the flip side, I developed a lot of skills - not too much around a house I can't do ;-) "Why given a pocket knife, I'll walk into the woods and build a shopping mall." (okay, maybe not, I just love that reworked line from a movie).

[carolina-rig-01]

Originally Posted by Abbeysdad

In 1979 I/we built a Ridge home. Ridge Homes was part of the Evans Corporation, and a sister company of Grossman's Lumber. You pick a model (we chose a left handed Caldwell - a two story, three bedroom, 1 3/4 bath).
On land you purchase separately, they build the foundation and shell. From the outside, it looks like a finished home, from the inside, it's all just bare studs. A truck arrives that you unload with all the finish building materials.
You do (or sub-contract) the plumbing, electrical, insulation, sub-floor, sheet rock, trim...
I sub'ed out the rough electrical to a fellow I knew from work, but we did all the rest ourselves! (oh, I hired a fellow to drill the well, another for the pump/pressure tank and someone else to install the septic system...."green acres is the place for me"...<hehe>)

I worked a 4 on / 4 off 12 hr work schedule which helped as on my 4 days off, I worked from dawn till dusk on the house. It was A LOT of work.

Now in theory, my effort was supposed to equate to about $10k in sweat equity. How this worked (since banks won't loan money to 'regular' people for unfinished homes) is that they setup a temporary 1 year loan to allow finishing the home, then you obtain a regular mortgage. The world went crazy that year. When we started building, interest rates were at 9%. When we were done, we were 'lucky' to get a variable 30 year at 14.5% !!! Needless to say, a refinance a few years later, resulted in a much better deal.
That aside, and investing a ton of time in my life, working with limited tools and very little extra money as 'out of pocket' was a killer, the house turned out pretty decent. I've had bragging rights for all these years.
I think the biggest thing was the shocked approval of my dad. He wasn't especially handy. I remember he happened to stop by after I had roughed in the plumbing and was about to do a leak test. There were no leaks. He left shaking his head saying, "I'll be damned". When the house was all finished, he said "you did a really good job, I didn't know you had it in you." Perhaps tongue in cheek praise, but praise non the less.
Building a house this way AND working a full time job is something for a naive 25 year old, but not something I'd do today.
I don't even know if there are outfits like Ridge and Miles homes that do this kind of build today. I remember hearing back then that a lot of shells were built and not finished due to skills and money and time... It's a lot of work or money to finish a home.
On the flip side, I developed a lot of skills - not too much around a house I can't do ;-) "Why given a pocket knife, I'll walk into the woods and build a shopping mall." (okay, maybe not, I just love that reworked line from a movie).

Great story, that is really cool! I know that they sell log cabin kits that sound a lot like the same deal that you guys did. They look really cool in the pictures but I haven't done any research on them.

[Embrey]

Originally Posted by carolina-rig-01

Great story, that is really cool! I know that they sell log cabin kits that sound a lot like the same deal that you guys did. They look really cool in the pictures but I haven't done any research on them.

expensive...LOL