AllStar Dilemma, need some facts.

[FlyRod]

Obituary: My Team AllStar TAS807C, 6'8" Heavy Action...blah, blah, etc., bit the dust last Saturday due to a hatch lid being slammed on it. No charges are pending.

Now...this rod, just over a year old, has GOLD-colored guides in "chrome?" frames.
Problem: The new one, same model, that I picked up at Academy today has a label wrapped around the grip that states the rod is equipped with Fuji Aluminum Oxide guides...the dark grey ones...the cheaper ones in the Fuji line. The frames look similar EXCEPT the older rod's GOLD guides are retained in place by frames that are slightly wider.

The question (no guesses, please): Did Shakespeare, having bought AllStar, go to cheaper guides while keeping the price the same (100 bux)?

I use braid on these and I have some concerns re the quality of the "new" guides, and their abrasion resistance, versus the older GOLD guides. I use this model for pitching into brush and often have to rare back and "stick 'em". Ergo, I want guides that can take the abuse of braided line.

If I can determine that they've done some cost-cutting at the expense of a great stick it's going back to Academy and I'll seek elsewhere...Avid? Crucial?

Does anyone know the facts OR have a phone number for the AllStar plant?

Thanks!
F.Rod

PS: Here's a response I received on another board. Any comments?
FlyRod,
Quote:
Now...this rod, just over a year old, has GOLD-colored guides in "chrome?" frames.
Problem:

They are probably Gold Cermet Guides, (Solid Gold Ceramic Ring (Not Plated) - Diamond Polished) with (Titanium Alloy Frame).
Quote:
The new one, same model, that I picked up at Academy today has a label wrapped around the grip that states the rod is equipped with Fuji Aluminum Oxide guides...the dark grey ones...the cheaper ones in the Fuji line.

If they are aluminum oxide ring it is diamond polished to a mirror finish and assembled with a polymer shock ring for increased impact resistance.
As far as braid resistance I have never wrapped a rod with aluminum oxide rings. The cheapest guides I use are Fuji Hardloy and they are "braid resistant".

Quote:
The question (no guesses, please): Did Shakespeare, having bought AllStar, go to cheaper guides while keeping the price the same (100 bux)?

I wouldn't put it past them to try. But it all would be guessing from any reply here unless it was from a factory head who is privy to that company information.
All Star Rods

Tight Lines!

[Rebbasser]

That I don't know, but I sure wish you would let me pay for it since I was the one that caused the obituary to have to be written!

[FlyRod]

Originally Posted by Rebbasser

That I don't know, but I sure wish you would let me pay for it since I was the one that caused the obituary to have to be written!

Fuggidaboutit!

F.Rod

[1FASTLASER]

Originally Posted by FlyRod

Obituary: My Team AllStar TAS807C, 6'8" Heavy Action...blah, blah, etc., bit the dust last Saturday due to a hatch lid being slammed on it. No charges are pending.

Now...this rod, just over a year old, has GOLD-colored guides in "chrome?" frames.
Problem: The new one, same model, that I picked up at Academy today has a label wrapped around the grip that states the rod is equipped with Fuji Aluminum Oxide guides...the dark grey ones...the cheaper ones in the Fuji line. The frames look similar EXCEPT the older rod's GOLD guides are retained in place by frames that are slightly wider.

The question (no guesses, please): Did Shakespeare, having bought AllStar, go to cheaper guides while keeping the price the same (100 bux)?

I use braid on these and I have some concerns re the quality of the "new" guides, and their abrasion resistance, versus the older GOLD guides. I use this model for pitching into brush and often have to rare back and "stick 'em". Ergo, I want guides that can take the abuse of braided line.

If I can determine that they've done some cost-cutting at the expense of a great stick it's going back to Academy and I'll seek elsewhere...Avid? Crucial?

Does anyone know the facts OR have a phone number for the AllStar plant?

Thanks!
F.Rod

PS: Here's a response I received on another board. Any comments?
FlyRod,
Quote:
Now...this rod, just over a year old, has GOLD-colored guides in "chrome?" frames.
Problem:

They are probably Gold Cermet Guides, (Solid Gold Ceramic Ring (Not Plated) - Diamond Polished) with (Titanium Alloy Frame).
Quote:
The new one, same model, that I picked up at Academy today has a label wrapped around the grip that states the rod is equipped with Fuji Aluminum Oxide guides...the dark grey ones...the cheaper ones in the Fuji line.

If they are aluminum oxide ring it is diamond polished to a mirror finish and assembled with a polymer shock ring for increased impact resistance.
As far as braid resistance I have never wrapped a rod with aluminum oxide rings. The cheapest guides I use are Fuji Hardloy and they are "braid resistant".

Quote:
The question (no guesses, please): Did Shakespeare, having bought AllStar, go to cheaper guides while keeping the price the same (100 bux)?

I wouldn't put it past them to try. But it all would be guessing from any reply here unless it was from a factory head who is privy to that company information.
All Star Rods

Tight Lines!

Due to the fact that I not only do rod repair and build custom rods I talk from experience and also knowledgs. To give you a for instance All Starts so called new Titanium rod is the same rod blank they been using on there high end models they just changed the guides to a black chrome guide frame with a titanium coated insert. The guides on your particular rod (speaking of the new one) will not have the life span when using braid line. Silicone carbide guides and tips are the best as far as heat dissitation and longevity when using braid. Shakesphere is doing some retooling on the Allstar line and there is alot of debate going on. They will continue to keep the Allstar line up but the retooling does mean they are changing some of the components used. It remains to be seen as to whether or not the emails,letters and so forth causes them to keep the line the same as when it was Allstar.

[FlyRod]

Well, it's all over but the being in hock.
After looking at the specs on several rods to replace the defunct TAS807C, I've ordered a (I must be nuts) Kistler Helium LTA 7' Heavy/Fast. That's well over a hundred clams more that the AllStar but I get free shipping, should be here before the weekend, and they have a great warranty. They ship in PVC AND I dodge sales tax. Added a few Swimblades to the order and "Voila".
I was gonna order a 6'10 Hvy/F Crucial but they were out of those. Just my luck.
I guess my AllStar days are over, but I do have some of the older TAS and will definitely try to preserve those.


F. "Broke" Rod

My sincerest gratitude to Clint at http://sportsmansoutfitters.com/shop...4cd6ab6a943687
A superior guy. Helpful in every way.

[lizardsrule]

Originally Posted by FlyRod

Well, it's all over but the being in hock.
After looking at the specs on several rods to replace the defunct TAS807C, I've ordered a (I must be nuts) Kistler Helium LTA 7' Heavy/Fast. That's well over a hundred clams more that the AllStar but I get free shipping, should be here before the weekend, and they have a great warranty. They ship in PVC AND I dodge sales tax. Added a few Swimblades to the order and "Voila".
I was gonna order a 6'10 Hvy/F Crucial but they were out of those. Just my luck.
I guess my AllStar days are over, but I do have some of the older TAS and will definitely try to preserve those.


F. "Broke" Rod

My sincerest gratitude to Clint at http://sportsmansoutfitters.com/shop...4cd6ab6a943687
A superior guy. Helpful in every way.

You seem to be a very knowledgeable guy about bassin. I hope you aren't disappointed in the Kistler. I've heard from others, and myself who have had them snap on a hookset. They appear to be very brittle/fragile IMO. I know several guys on the other hand who swear by them, including Art Ferguson III. They do feel great, and are super light, but I won't buy another one.

Lizards

[pig n jig]

Haaaaaaaaaaa, Lizyrds, I just knew you were going to post.I was going to bait the post, but no need. I wasn't impressed with the Kistler floppin stick I had, luckily, they are a hot item, so I only lost $20.00 on the deal when I sold it after owning it for 2 weeks.Mine didn't break though, I really thought the fine peice of craftmanship was gonna though.P N J

[dodgeguy]

if i was buying any of the new allstar rods it would be the platinum series with alconite guides.but imho you cannot beat a bass pro shops johnny morris signature series especially for the money.

[FlyRod]

I've heard the stories too, but I've got sense enough not to overpower on the hook set, I hope. Besides, the warranty on these rods is reputed to be fantastic so if a mishap (other than PARTNER-related) occurs I should be OK.
I'm very much lightness obsessed, especially with rods for applications that call for maximum sensitivity and minimal physical wear and tear on hands, wrists, etc. Rebbassist can attest to that, as he saw me stick to rigs such as a Chronarch 50MG, a medium/fast 6'6" TAS785C, and a 4" Tiki Stick most of last Saturday. That rod and reel combo probably weighs less than 12 ounces and I can fling it all day.

I rarely use deep cranks simply because they bring pain! I prefer to throw 1/8-3/8 spinnerbaits rather than heavier ones and prefer willow leaf blades for the same reason I rarely toss DD22s or others of their ilk (no relation to Elk, a large cervine mammal.)
The only time I subject myself to hard labor is when I cast a Spook, and a Super Jr. at that.

The rod won't be here until Thursday at the earliest, so won't be using it tomorrow at Bastrop Lake. My pitchin' will be done with either a St.Crotch Avid 6'6"MHF or a Lowrider 5-17 (when it's not throwing a Horny Toad or Buzzzzzzzzzzzzbait.) If it gets here Thursday I'll give it a whirl on Canyon Lake on Friday. Failing that it'll get it's baptism the following Friday when fishing with Reb("Ol' Crunchie")basser.

Will report.

FlyRod

[pig n jig]

House Fly ,If I were to take a guess, it sounds like the next thread your gonna post is how you broke a nail while fishing ?I can tell you weren't airborne infantry, you wouldn't be whining like a little sissy about the weight of fishing gear while out on the water, doing what you like to do more than anything else in life.Lmao.... P.S. Nothing personal, tit for tat,just Zooker and I grew up in the same area. P N J

[JB]

hey flyguy,
try working a rogue for 4-8 hours and then those dd22 will seem
like a {walk in da park}~

[1FASTLASER]

Originally Posted by FlyRod

I've heard the stories too, but I've got sense enough not to overpower on the hook set, I hope. Besides, the warranty on these rods is reputed to be fantastic so if a mishap (other than PARTNER-related) occurs I should be OK.
I'm very much lightness obsessed, especially with rods for applications that call for maximum sensitivity and minimal physical wear and tear on hands, wrists, etc. Rebbassist can attest to that, as he saw me stick to rigs such as a Chronarch 50MG, a medium/fast 6'6" TAS785C, and a 4" Tiki Stick most of last Saturday. That rod and reel combo probably weighs less than 12 ounces and I can fling it all day.

I rarely use deep cranks simply because they bring pain! I prefer to throw 1/8-3/8 spinnerbaits rather than heavier ones and prefer willow leaf blades for the same reason I rarely toss DD22s or others of their ilk (no relation to Elk, a large cervine mammal.)
The only time I subject myself to hard labor is when I cast a Spook, and a Super Jr. at that.

The rod won't be here until Thursday at the earliest, so won't be using it tomorrow at Bastrop Lake. My pitchin' will be done with either a St.Crotch Avid 6'6"MHF or a Lowrider 5-17 (when it's not throwing a Horny Toad or Buzzzzzzzzzzzzbait.) If it gets here Thursday I'll give it a whirl on Canyon Lake on Friday. Failing that it'll get it's baptism the following Friday when fishing with Reb("Ol' Crunchie")basser.

Will report.

FlyRod

I'm with you flyrod on the light part of your equation. May I suggest you give a airrus rod a try. After they won the icast show in '02 I became very ibterested in them and after doing some careful research and then tried them they are now my rod of choice. They have eliminated the spine in a rod which to say the least greatly enhances sensitivity. They are actually lighter than allstar's and dont have to mortage the house to get there topend rod. They also have a over the counter lifetime warranty. Break it you get a new one. I did break one rod and it was a first for the company but it was there earliest rod the sirrus that I broke. No questions and got a new one as soon as I got in.

[zooker]

hmmm ever wonder why i use a 7 foot HEAVY stick for non stop spinnerbait fun. light is objective -kinda like clear water- i like a rod that is a middle the road weight not to heavy to cast and not a fairy wand either.. fenwick hmx perfectly smack in the middle weight wise..




zooker

[FlyRod]

Originally Posted by pig n jig

House Fly ,If I were to take a guess, it sounds like the next thread your gonna post is how you broke a nail while fishing ?I can tell you weren't airborne infantry, you wouldn't be whining like a little sissy about the weight of fishing gear while out on the water, doing what you like to do more than anything else in life.Lmao.... P.S. Nothing personal, tit for tat,just Zooker and I grew up in the same area. P N J

Originally Posted by pig n jig

House Fly ,If I were to take a guess, it sounds like the next thread your gonna post is how you broke a nail while fishing ?I can tell you weren't airborne infantry, you wouldn't be whining like a little sissy about the weight of fishing gear while out on the water, doing what you like to do more than anything else in life.Lmao.... P.S. Nothing personal, tit for tat,just Zooker and I grew up in the same area. P N J

Nope, not Airborne Infants. Y'see, they determined that I was sharp enough to master a weapons system more complicated than a very large folding umbrella. So, not only did they give me my very own tank, they gave me five of them, then, a couple of years and two promos later, they gave me seventeen of them. All I had to do was remember where we parked them and think up seventeen nicknames beginning with "A".

Now, as to lightness of tackle...why not? Any gain from unnecessary pain?
From age 12 until age 59 ('cept during turret time, although I did sit in with the 24th Div Band, The 22 ARVN Div Band-deceased, as well as the 8th Army Band and the ROK Army Band) I was a serious concert band trumpeter/cornetist. Excess wear and tear on my digits was not a good thing. Until I packed away 28 different horns in Dec. 02 I often came skidding into rehearsal still smelling of PowerBait solution, sweat, and bass (and often with sunburned lips...owwwww!).
If my hands were hurting it showed in my playing. Find recordings of marches like "Rolling Thunder", "Barnum and Bailey's Favorite", or a trumpet trio like "Buglers Holiday" and you'll understand the problem.
I'll try to post some links to these ditties later.
Anyway, times were tough on Bastrop Lake today (Wed.) We fished for 12.5 hrs for a measly 15 bass boated and released. T'storms during the night must have put them in a fickle frame of mind. I had thought it would light 'em up...nope.
We threw everything at them. In fact, I hooked a good 'un a chartreuse kitchen sink...but he got off.

Will report after first use of the Kistler. Hopefully that will be Friday at Canyon Lake.

FR

[pig n jig]

Originally Posted by FlyRod

Nope, not Airborne Infants. Y'see, they determined that I was sharp enough to master a weapons system more complicated than a very large folding umbrella. So, not only did they give me my very own tank, they gave me five of them, then, a couple of years and two promos later, they gave me seventeen of them. All I had to do was remember where we parked them and think up seventeen nicknames beginning with "A".

Now, as to lightness of tackle...why not? Any gain from unnecessary pain?
From age 12 until age 59 ('cept during turret time, although I did sit in with the 24th Div Band, The 22 ARVN Div Band-deceased, as well as the 8th Army Band and the ROK Army Band) I was a serious concert band trumpeter/cornetist. Excess wear and tear on my digits was not a good thing. Until I packed away 28 different horns in Dec. 02 I often came skidding into rehearsal still smelling of PowerBait solution, sweat, and bass (and often with sunburned lips...owwwww!).
If my hands were hurting it showed in my playing. Find recordings of marches like "Rolling Thunder", "Barnum and Bailey's Favorite", or a trumpet trio like "Buglers Holiday" and you'll understand the problem.
I'll try to post some links to these ditties later.

FR

Mechanized fat lazy slugs didn't have enough balls to jump out of their bunks, let alone from an airplane.They would rather crawl around in their garbage cans on tracks, than to exert real physical energy.You do realize that they put the idiots who couldn't drive a Hum vee in a tank to prevent damage to their equipment, its pretty difficult to hurt a tank, don't you think ?.As for you being an officer, that don't bode well either. The idiot officers we had in charge stood around from a distance, looking like the little book smart dweebs they really were, while trying to bark orders in their squeaky little feminine voices, while all spit shined from head to toe. The non commisioned troops serving their country was busting their @sses, while training hard to be prepared to defend their country.Its no different out here in the cilvilian world.You can post your stupid tank thread, I will post my creed.THE AIRBORNE CREED
I am an Airborne trooper! A PARATROOPER!
I jump by parachute from any plane in flight. I volunteered to do it, knowing well the hazards of my choice.
I serve in a mighty Airborne Force--famed for deeds in war--renowned for readiness in peace. It is my pledge to uphold its honor and prestige in all I am--in all I do.
I am an elite trooper--a sky trooper--a shock trooper--a spearhead trooper. I blaze the way to far-flung goals--behind, before, above the foe's front line.
I know that I may have to fight without support for days on end. Therefore, I keep mind and body always fit to do my part in any Airborne task. I am self-reliant and unafraid. I shoot true, and march fast and far. I fight hard and excel in every art and artifice of war.
I never fail a fellow trooper. I cherish as a sacred trust the lives of men with whom I serve. Leaders have my fullest loyalty, and those I lead never find me lacking.
I have pride in the Airborne! I never let it down!
In peace, I do not shrink the dullest of duty not protest the toughest training. My weapons and equipment are always combat ready. I am neat of dress--military in courtesy--proper in conduct and behavior.
In battle, I fear no foe's ability, nor under-estimate his prowess, power and guile. I fight him with all my might and skills--ever alert to evade capture or escape a trap. I never surrender, though I be the last.
My goal in peace or war is to succeed in any mission of the day--or die, if needs be, in the try.
I belong to a proud and glorious team--the Airborne, the Army, my Country. I am its chosen pride to fight where others may not go--to serve them well until the final victory.
I am the trooper of the sky! I am my Nation's best! In peace and war I never fail. Anywhere, anytime, in anything--I AM AIRBORNE!

[FlyRod]

Originally Posted by pig n jig

You want to think your sharp ? Ask yourself, how you would have stacked up against the 7th Panzer division ?Your no Erwin Rommel. Ironic, I named my cat Rommel after him,the greatest mechanized slug in history. Why ? In 1910 he started his military career as a officer cadet of the 124th infantry regiment.The man had balls & brains, proved to be most difficult to defeat.P N J

Most regrettable that some can dish it, and not take it.
My post was written tongue in cheek, with some explanation as to why I took care of my mitts. Yours, well,...
Now, back in "Gentleman Mode": Erwin Rommel is/was a man I greatly admired. He was not much of a Nazi, and that's why Hitler forced him to commit suicide.
So far as me v. the 7th PD... Well, I did have high tank AND high company in a division "shoot off" many moons ago. I believe it's whomever gets off the first well-aimed round that is declared the winner, and we could go from an empty chamber, acquire the target and have a round on it in record time, with the (usually) unneeded "chaser" out of the muzzle in around four-five seconds
The real German "Tank Guy", BTW, was General Heinz Guderian, and HE started in a Signals unit. He developed the BlitzKrieg concept and, after the war, the Allies could find NO grounds to charge him with war crimes.
I have read and reread his book "Panzer Leader" many times since my school days. Good read and I recommend it.
http://search.netscape.com/ns/boomfr...Fguderian.html
http://search.netscape.com/ns/boomfr...4-0306811014-0
My late uncle "Sonny", 36th Inf Div (Texas!) had a personal experience with Field Marshall Rommel in Africa, but it'll keep for another time. Suffice it to say that "Unc" was a great and grateful admirer of Erwin Rommel.

Cheerio!

Rod, F.
Iron Horse Soldier
Graphite Blade "Swordsman"
Defender of The Faith
Catch and Release Advocate

PS: I didn't become a fat slug until waaaaaaaay later! But I made up for lost time.

[FlyRod]

...the Kistler Helium arrived today. It floated in on an air current from Alabama so they must really use helium....
I put a CastaicSF on it w/#30 Spectrex braid and a #20 fluoro leader. Will pitch and flip with it tomorrow at Beautiful Canyon Lake, the Jewel of The Texas Hill Country...right! (see: Lake Lice) Will report.
I think them thar blue guides are right purdy.

FlyRodperson

[JB]

sounds Sweeeet flyrod, go wet a line!

[pig n jig]

Fly rod, I was being nice.I have no boundaries .I am glad you like the Kistler. P N J

[FlyRod]

Originally Posted by pig n jig

Fly rod, I was being nice.I have no boundaries .I am glad you like the Kistler. P N J

Awwww...that's OK.
Thanks,

FR

[pig n jig]

Flyrod, You ever seen the Castaway Bud Pruitt series flipping stick ? I know they are made in Texas. They are what I chose over the Kistler, but everyone has a different opinions on what a flippin stick should be like. Did you throw the kistler rod in the water to see if it floated like they claim it does ?The guy that bought mine wanted to try floating in before he bought it. I told him once he gives me the money, I'll gladly let him throw it in the lake.He didn't seem so anxious to test it after he bought it. P N J

[dodgeguy]

apparently they are hardloy guides.the old guides were titanium nitrided stainless steel.here's an email from allstar.


i emailed allstar and this is their official answer.the old guides were titanium nitrided stainless steel .

We changed the guide cause of corrosion, and the fuji guides are an upgrade as opposed to a down grade, we were also having problems with the inserts coming out of the guides.

Have a great day
Consumer Service Rep.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Felicia Payne [mailto:felicia@shakespeare-fishing.com]
Sent: Monday, April 24, 2006 10:13 AM
To: MELISSA@SHAKESPEARE-FISHING.COM
Subject: FW: question about rod guides

[lizardsrule]

Originally Posted by dodgeguy

apparently they are hardloy guides.the old guides were titanium nitrided stainless steel.here's an email from allstar.


i emailed allstar and this is their official answer.the old guides were titanium nitrided stainless steel .

We changed the guide cause of corrosion, and the fuji guides are an upgrade as opposed to a down grade, we were also having problems with the inserts coming out of the guides.

Have a great day
Consumer Service Rep.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Felicia Payne [mailto:felicia@shakespeare-fishing.com]
Sent: Monday, April 24, 2006 10:13 AM
To: MELISSA@SHAKESPEARE-FISHING.COM
Subject: FW: question about rod guides

I call BS. That's the script they were given to read or type. They are cutting costs, to improve profitability or a new market share with a price point.

Lizards

[FlyRod]

Originally Posted by pig n jig

Flyrod, You ever seen the Castaway Bud Pruitt series flipping stick ? I know they are made in Texas. They are what I chose over the Kistler, but everyone has a different opinions on what a flippin stick should be like. Did you throw the kistler rod in the water to see if it floated like they claim it does ?The guy that bought mine wanted to try floating in before he bought it. I told him once he gives me the money, I'll gladly let him throw it in the lake.He didn't seem so anxious to test it after he bought it. P N J

Well, I'm not limiting the Kistler to flippin' duties. It's actually described as being a "Do everything" rod and did seem to flip well last Friday. I'm more of a pitcher than a flippist so the Kistler will function in many roles.
Also I'm probably gonna keep the new TAS807C 6'8" as my primary pitcher despite some doubts re the guides. I can always order a set of Cermet guides and find some starving, half-blind, arthritic, street urchin to wrap 'em on in exchange for half a banana and a bottle of flat RC Cola(TM) with a dead roach in it.
Of course, this means buying yet another CastaicSF or TDA153HST...damn!

Fly Rod

[Rebbasser]

Of course, this means buying yet another CastaicSF or TDA153HST...damn!

Like that would really upset you