Need help!!

triglet · 04-22-10, 10:49 PM

ok i have been fishing with power pro 30# braid. this has happened to me alot here recently. when i set the hook its like my knot broke or something. reel the line in and sure enough no hook no bait. However the knot in the line that was attached to the hook is still intact. what is causing this. is the hook eyelet opening up and allowing the line to pass out of it??? im using the basic fisherman knot. any advice???

WTL · 04-22-10, 11:02 PM

This is a palomar knot, which is probably the most popular knot with braided line. I use the same size and brand line and use this knot with no problems.

I don't know, but it sounds like you could be using a "clinch" knot. That is what many people start with, and its fine for mono, but with braid it will slip past the secondary knot a lot.

triglet · 04-22-10, 11:09 PM

yeah i have been using the "clinch knot" never had any problems until recently. guessing im just gonna have to change to the polamor knot. blowed my mind when i reeled in and there was no hook but my knot was still intact on the line. cost me some nice fish.

MississippiBoy · 04-22-10, 11:47 PM

Wait, so the knot didn't pull out...you're saying the line broke right at the hook? That doesn't sound like a knot problem, that's more of a line/hook problem. I've been using Power Pro for a couple years, and the only time I've had it break like that was when I was trying to break it off when hung.
Has this happened to you often? What style of hook are you using, and what brand? Off the top of my head, one problem could be that the eye of the hook is opening slightly, and the sharp edge is fraying the line, weakening it.
By the way, when I tie a Palomar knot, I'll sometimes do step #2 twice, making kind of a double Palomar.

islandbass · 04-23-10, 03:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by triglet

yeah i have been using the "clinch knot" never had any problems until recently. guessing im just gonna have to change to the polamor knot. blowed my mind when i reeled in and there was no hook but my knot was still intact on the line. cost me some nice fish.

As stated already, the improved clinch knot can slip loose with braid.

Hoever, if the knot is intact and the hook is gone, the only way that could I happen, I would surmise, is somehow the eye of the hook came undone.

Are you fishing with a very tight drag? As we all know, with a tight enough drag setting, hooks can be straightened out and undone. It would seem if your case, instead of becoming bent from the point side, it would appear that the eye came undone. Hope those aren't Trokar hooks.

Perhaps you could try to duplicate this outcome in your yard by intentially snagging the hook in the yard and pulling as you did and observe what happens. I am sure this has piqued the curiosity of others here.

BigBassin144 · 04-23-10, 09:08 AM

This is very interesting. Like others have said, even if it isn't the problem, I would switch to the palomar knot. It is all I use for braid, and I normally tie a simple overhand knot on top of the palomar for added security.

Now, you're problem does sound like, like some of the guys said, the braid is either being cut by where the hook's eye is clamped closed or the eye is somehow opening up.

It may not seem likely, but a lot of the times, the knot will slide to the side of the eye where the small opening is. This can, over time, cut through your line whether it be braid, fluoro, or mono. I think this would be much more likely than the eye opening up unless you're using a very cheap, or very light wire hook. I would think the hook would straighten out before the eye would open, but it's still possible.

BB

Vegasspider · 04-23-10, 09:08 AM

I can so help with this. #1 a cinch knot will come undone every time. The Berkley braid knot works best if your tying directly to the braid. Without fail please use a leader with a uni to uni know. It’s gets to the spot faster and stays in the zone longer I suggest 4-7” leader. My standard rig is 30lb Power Pro with XPS Japanese maid 8-12” leader and never and I mean never had a knot come undone and the feel is second to none. With drop shot use tungsten to increase feel. Also, do some research on “snap strength” with braid. So if you must tie directly to hook with no leader only knot that works is Berkley braid knot but a leader with uni to uni is fool proof and no disappointments. Pretty much my exclusive set up.
http://www.bigchipnet.com/bcnv2/begi...raid&cat=knots

triglet · 04-23-10, 11:55 AM

yeah im beginning to think the line is slipping through the eyelet hole. because the line is not cut it is still intact in everyway. and also still has the knot tired and still has the loop hole where the hook used to be. and yeah drag is pretty tight. when i get off work next week ill do an at home test and see if i can reproduce this.. but im about 90% sure its the eye of the hook opening up a little and the line slipping out that way.

MississippiBoy · 04-23-10, 12:06 PM

Yeah, definitely a hook problem, then. If the loop and knot and everything is still there, then the eye of the hook is definitely opening up. Do you remember what brand of hooks this happened with? Eagle Claw, Owner, Gamakatsu.....?

WTL · 04-23-10, 04:05 PM

This just doesnt happen to me much...at all.. Like Mississip, I am now wondering what hook brand you are using and if thats the problem. There is a wide disparity of quality in hooks, perhaps more so than even in line.

Cavs1123 · 04-23-10, 04:37 PM

I use a palomar with no problems

Bassboss · 04-23-10, 06:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by triglet

yeah i have been using the "clinch knot" never had any problems until recently. guessing im just gonna have to change to the polamor knot. blowed my mind when i reeled in and there was no hook but my knot was still intact on the line. cost me some nice fish.

Yup! Clinch knot will never work in braid. Polomar is the way to go!!

Rebbasser · 04-24-10, 01:52 AM

Palomar knot is the way to go. Easy to tie and I'd bet it will solve your problem.

BigBassin144 · 04-24-10, 09:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cavs1123

I use a palomar with no problems

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bassboss

Yup! Clinch knot will never work in braid. Polomar is the way to go!!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rebbasser

Palomar knot is the way to go. Easy to tie and I'd bet it will solve your problem.

Guys, if the knot if coming back completely intact, then it obviously not the knot. While I agree the palomar is the best knot to use in braid, I don't think it's going to solve his problem.

While I've never heard of hook eyes opening up like that, it is possible. If you're using a very cheap hook, or maybe you just got a bad pack of a good brand. I'd recommend using Owner or Gamakatsu hooks. If you want something a little less expensive, Mustads would be my choice.

BB

Strike_King 609 · 04-26-10, 12:36 PM

try using flurocarbon it has more strech then braid or try changing out the line i just had the same problem with my 7-3 vendetta i have 20 power pro it i lost 3 lures this weekend so it was time to put some new line on i find that when the power pro gets warn it loses it strength.

Vegasspider · 04-28-10, 12:11 AM

Ouch three lures that sucks. I complain more about a lost lure than the extra gas it takes to run around the lake....

Quote:

Originally Posted by Strike_King 609

try using flurocarbon it has more strech then braid or try changing out the line i just had the same problem with my 7-3 vendetta i have 20 power pro it i lost 3 lures this weekend so it was time to put some new line on i find that when the power pro gets warn it loses it strength.

triglet · 04-28-10, 02:13 AM

wow 3 baits that sucks. i've lost about 5 fish because of this. luckily its only cost me a hook and a fluke each time and 1 nice bass that would have been over 5 lbs. but its the hook eye opening up on me and the line slipping out from around the opening. im hoping the palomar know will take care of this. it looks like it holds on to the hook eye better than the clinch knot will. for what its worth ive never lost any other bait that the line attaches straight to the bait. i.e. spinnerbait, crankbait, topwater.

triglet · 04-28-10, 02:15 AM

and for those that were asking i believe it's eagle claw that is at my local walmart that have been opening up like this. even though i did lose one gammy hook. and if memory serves me correct they are all 3/0 hooks maybe 4/0.

WTL · 04-28-10, 11:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by triglet

and for those that were asking i believe it's eagle claw that is at my local walmart that have been opening up like this. even though i did lose one gammy hook. and if memory serves me correct they are all 3/0 hooks maybe 4/0.

Triglet, I think I would throw away those eagle claws if I were you.

Not many use them anyway, but thats just terrible.

triglet · 04-29-10, 01:25 AM

WTL dont worry they already in the trash. never had a problem before and it completely baffled me as to why it was happening. but glad i got it figured out. its hard enough to catch fish around here without equipment failure

.

triglet · 05-13-10, 01:47 AM

well just a follow up. switched to polamor knot and so far havent lost anymore hooks. also upgraded my hooks from the cheap wlamart hooks.

nofearengineer · 05-13-10, 09:21 AM

Good to hear, Triglet.

As one of the guys who usually believes that most of the "this lure/hook/line is better than the others" is mostly hype, I have to admit, that there is also a small amount of true crap out there on the shelves, just waiting for the unwary to buy it.

Hopefully, you won't be losing any more hooks...on accident anyway.

triglet · 05-14-10, 01:21 AM

yeah i have always had the mindset hey a hook is a hook. you can sharpen all of them and be ok. obviously i was wrong in my assumption.

BigBassin144 · 05-14-10, 08:25 AM

Triglet, glad to hear everything worked out good.

BB

04-22-10, 11:47 PM	#4
MississippiBoy BassFishin.Com Super Veteran Join Date: May 2007 Location: Ridgeland MS Posts: 3,923	Wait, so the knot didn't pull out...you're saying the line broke right at the hook? That doesn't sound like a knot problem, that's more of a line/hook problem. I've been using Power Pro for a couple years, and the only time I've had it break like that was when I was trying to break it off when hung. Has this happened to you often? What style of hook are you using, and what brand? Off the top of my head, one problem could be that the eye of the hook is opening slightly, and the sharp edge is fraying the line, weakening it. By the way, when I tie a Palomar knot, I'll sometimes do step #2 twice, making kind of a double Palomar. __________________ I smell smoke, and I hear sirens. Do you think that's a problem?

04-23-10, 09:08 AM	#6
BigBassin144 BassFishin.Com Premier Elite Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Toledo, Ohio Posts: 9,463	This is very interesting. Like others have said, even if it isn't the problem, I would switch to the palomar knot. It is all I use for braid, and I normally tie a simple overhand knot on top of the palomar for added security. Now, you're problem does sound like, like some of the guys said, the braid is either being cut by where the hook's eye is clamped closed or the eye is somehow opening up. It may not seem likely, but a lot of the times, the knot will slide to the side of the eye where the small opening is. This can, over time, cut through your line whether it be braid, fluoro, or mono. I think this would be much more likely than the eye opening up unless you're using a very cheap, or very light wire hook. I would think the hook would straighten out before the eye would open, but it's still possible. BB __________________ As of June 14, 2014 the members of the BF.com forum have moved to basschat.yuku.com!

04-23-10, 12:06 PM	#9
MississippiBoy BassFishin.Com Super Veteran Join Date: May 2007 Location: Ridgeland MS Posts: 3,923	Yeah, definitely a hook problem, then. If the loop and knot and everything is still there, then the eye of the hook is definitely opening up. Do you remember what brand of hooks this happened with? Eagle Claw, Owner, Gamakatsu.....? __________________ I smell smoke, and I hear sirens. Do you think that's a problem? Last edited by MississippiBoy; 04-23-10 at 04:11 PM. Reason: Spelling

04-23-10, 04:37 PM	#11
Cavs1123 BassFishin.Com Super Veteran Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Bellevue, Ohio Posts: 1,398	I use a palomar with no problems __________________ Tom

04-24-10, 01:52 AM	#13
Rebbasser BassFishin.Com Premier Elite Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: San Antonio, TX Posts: 10,141	Palomar knot is the way to go. Easy to tie and I'd bet it will solve your problem. __________________ It's happened to the best of them: John 21:3

04-22-10, 10:49 PM	#1
triglet BassFishin.Com Member Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 39	Need help!! ok i have been fishing with power pro 30# braid. this has happened to me alot here recently. when i set the hook its like my knot broke or something. reel the line in and sure enough no hook no bait. However the knot in the line that was attached to the hook is still intact. what is causing this. is the hook eyelet opening up and allowing the line to pass out of it??? im using the basic fisherman knot. any advice???

04-22-10, 11:02 PM	#2
WTL BassFishin.Com Premier Elite Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Huntsville, Al Posts: 7,466	This is a palomar knot, which is probably the most popular knot with braided line. I use the same size and brand line and use this knot with no problems. I don't know, but it sounds like you could be using a "clinch" knot. That is what many people start with, and its fine for mono, but with braid it will slip past the secondary knot a lot.

04-22-10, 11:09 PM	#3
triglet BassFishin.Com Member Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 39	yeah i have been using the "clinch knot" never had any problems until recently. guessing im just gonna have to change to the polamor knot. blowed my mind when i reeled in and there was no hook but my knot was still intact on the line. cost me some nice fish.

04-23-10, 09:08 AM	#7
Vegasspider BassFishin.Com Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 570	I can so help with this. #1 a cinch knot will come undone every time. The Berkley braid knot works best if your tying directly to the braid. Without fail please use a leader with a uni to uni know. It’s gets to the spot faster and stays in the zone longer I suggest 4-7” leader. My standard rig is 30lb Power Pro with XPS Japanese maid 8-12” leader and never and I mean never had a knot come undone and the feel is second to none. With drop shot use tungsten to increase feel. Also, do some research on “snap strength” with braid. So if you must tie directly to hook with no leader only knot that works is Berkley braid knot but a leader with uni to uni is fool proof and no disappointments. Pretty much my exclusive set up. http://www.bigchipnet.com/bcnv2/begi...raid&cat=knots

04-23-10, 11:55 AM	#8
triglet BassFishin.Com Member Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 39	yeah im beginning to think the line is slipping through the eyelet hole. because the line is not cut it is still intact in everyway. and also still has the knot tired and still has the loop hole where the hook used to be. and yeah drag is pretty tight. when i get off work next week ill do an at home test and see if i can reproduce this.. but im about 90% sure its the eye of the hook opening up a little and the line slipping out that way.

04-23-10, 04:05 PM	#10
WTL BassFishin.Com Premier Elite Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Huntsville, Al Posts: 7,466	This just doesnt happen to me much...at all.. Like Mississip, I am now wondering what hook brand you are using and if thats the problem. There is a wide disparity of quality in hooks, perhaps more so than even in line.

04-26-10, 12:36 PM	#15
Strike_King 609 BassFishin.Com Active Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: trenton NJ Posts: 151	try using flurocarbon it has more strech then braid or try changing out the line i just had the same problem with my 7-3 vendetta i have 20 power pro it i lost 3 lures this weekend so it was time to put some new line on i find that when the power pro gets warn it loses it strength. __________________ join my group on facebook Trenton New Jersey Bass Assassins

04-28-10, 02:13 AM	#17
triglet BassFishin.Com Member Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 39	wow 3 baits that sucks. i've lost about 5 fish because of this. luckily its only cost me a hook and a fluke each time and 1 nice bass that would have been over 5 lbs. but its the hook eye opening up on me and the line slipping out from around the opening. im hoping the palomar know will take care of this. it looks like it holds on to the hook eye better than the clinch knot will. for what its worth ive never lost any other bait that the line attaches straight to the bait. i.e. spinnerbait, crankbait, topwater.

04-28-10, 02:15 AM	#18
triglet BassFishin.Com Member Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 39	and for those that were asking i believe it's eagle claw that is at my local walmart that have been opening up like this. even though i did lose one gammy hook. and if memory serves me correct they are all 3/0 hooks maybe 4/0.

04-29-10, 01:25 AM	#20
triglet BassFishin.Com Member Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 39	WTL dont worry they already in the trash. never had a problem before and it completely baffled me as to why it was happening. but glad i got it figured out. its hard enough to catch fish around here without equipment failure.

05-13-10, 01:47 AM	#21
triglet BassFishin.Com Member Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 39	well just a follow up. switched to polamor knot and so far havent lost anymore hooks. also upgraded my hooks from the cheap wlamart hooks.

05-13-10, 09:21 AM	#22
nofearengineer BassFishin.Com Premier Elite Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Southwest IN Posts: 5,630	Good to hear, Triglet. As one of the guys who usually believes that most of the "this lure/hook/line is better than the others" is mostly hype, I have to admit, that there is also a small amount of true crap out there on the shelves, just waiting for the unwary to buy it. Hopefully, you won't be losing any more hooks...on accident anyway. __________________ Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing it is not fish they are after.

05-14-10, 01:21 AM	#23
triglet BassFishin.Com Member Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 39	yeah i have always had the mindset hey a hook is a hook. you can sharpen all of them and be ok. obviously i was wrong in my assumption.

05-14-10, 08:25 AM	#24
BigBassin144 BassFishin.Com Premier Elite Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Toledo, Ohio Posts: 9,463	Triglet, glad to hear everything worked out good. BB __________________ As of June 14, 2014 the members of the BF.com forum have moved to basschat.yuku.com!

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