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Old 09-19-12, 09:29 AM   #1
keithdog
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Default New strategies for 2013?

I know it may be a little early for this kind of post, but sitting home here from work sick, I needed something to do. Besides, us northern boys only have another 6-8 weeks of open water left. "I wish there was a sad face in the smilies faces to add here". Anyways, I was thinking it would make for a fun post to see what changes you already have in mind for your bass angling for 2013? Are you changing or adding anything? Trying out something new? I'll get it started.
The main thing I'm going to change is my choice of line weights. I know some folks will think I'm off my rocker, but hey, I can always change back. I still will use 50 lb. braid on my frog rod, and 15 pound braid on my one and only spinning rod which rarely sees any use. But up untill now, I've used an assortment of mono or copoly lines for other uses. I've used 12 pound mono for my medium diving cranks, and 15 pound mono for shallow and deep diving cranks and surface lures. I've used 17 pound for large surface lures, spinnerbaits, buzzbaits, jigs and worms, ect. And I use 20 pound copoly for pitchin t-rigged plastics. In 2013, I'm planning to simplify all that. I really prefer copoly over mono to begin with. I've decided to spool up with only two line weights next year. That being 15# and 20#. The 15# will be used for all my cranking needs and small topwater. The 20# line will be for everything else. And the line choice is PLINE Floroclear, a line I fell in love with years ago thanks to the suggestion of our buddy Rebbasser. Floroclear is an amazing line to cast with, handles beautifully. And it's strong. I've been using Sufix Elite for crankbaits and Seige where a tougher line application is required. And they are a decent line too. But I like Floroclear better than both and have found it to be just as strong and tough, but with a narrower line diameter. The 20# Floroclear has a line diameter of 0.0164 while the 17 # Seige line is 0.0160. Thats a virtual tie and line diameter thusly will not change how my lures work in the water, but I'll have that stronger line rating when I wish I had it. The Floroclears 15# diameter is similarly the same to 12 pound mono lines. And I'll get the benefits of a copoly over mono, and the flourocarbon coating that is on the Floroclear. I know many will question why I would want the heavier lines, so I'll explain. I've always been a believer in using the heaviest line you can get away with that will also allow the lure to work properly, and achieve the depth you need. I like the reasurance of the stronger line. I realize in certain bodies of water that are gin clear, lighter lines are prefereable, but thats not my situation. I fish naturally formed smaller shallower lakes about 90 acreas in size for the most part. Average depths between 12 and 18 foot depending on the lake with isolated deeper areas. They are full of weeds, "when the DNR doesn't spray them", and lots of brush and laydowns, as well as piers, ect. Areas where a heavier line is very helpfull. And as for crankbaits, I rarely ever work any water deeper than 15-17 foot deep. I don't need a narrower line to try to reach below that. Most of my cranking is going to be in water 8-15 foot deep on average, and often shallower. And I prefer a 15 pound line for working a large bodied crankbait because I believe the larger a crankbait is, the more stress it will put on the line in both casting and retrieving. Now if I were fishing in lakes that are mostly void of vegitation, which many of you here do, I could see the appeal of a lighter line, or if I were fishing deep clearwater lakes, where reaching down deep with your cranks is a must. But thats not my situation. So for 2013, I'm simplifying my line choices. I'm just going to be buying two lines and go from there.
So thats my gig for 2013. Whats yours?
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Last edited by keithdog; 09-19-12 at 09:37 AM.
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Old 09-19-12, 10:45 AM   #2
bassboogieman
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I don't know about fishing stratigies - but my friend, your posting stratagy should include PARAGRAPHS, so they can be more easily read and understood.

Can I ask a dumb question? OK, thanks, I will. First let me stipulate - I am NOT a tournament angler and every fish I catch, or do not catch, does not impact my fininacial balance sheet or anything else. Why do you feel the need to increase your line weight, particularyly in the non-braid line? I am exactly oppisite in my thinking. Regarding braid and why I exclude it from the decision to go heavier, it's thinner and I find anything under 20# difficult to cast, resulting in wind knots, loops on the end of the rod, digging in the spool, etc., so heavier test for braid I fully understand.

In the instance of co-poly, which we both seem to prefer, most are thinner than mono and therefore "stronger" in lines of similiar diameter - which is how Yo-Zuri (my preference, but I also use some of the P-LIne Fluroclear) is rated as to "line test" on the spool. I see you get the line diameter vs strength differential between co-poly and mono, but the choice to use co-poly in a similiar diameter as mono and gain strength, is directly opposite of my choice to maintain strength while reducing line "size". The other issue I have with "heavy" line (other than braid) is the managabilty of it on the reel. I've found the heavier (co-poly especially) is pretty stiff and has more memory issues, the lighter lines are bad enough.

Secondly, you and I fish northern water (mostly) and our bass are by a large margin under 5# on average. Now, if I was fishing southern water then I would increase my line strength in anticipation of catching something considerably larger. I choose co-poly for a couple reasons, the main one would be that it allows me to use a line of similiar strength with a smaller diameter (size, compared to mono) and that allows me to get a bait deeper and has less effect on a diving baits action. I think the heavier line does effect the action of a crankbait, so I want to use the smallest line I can without leaving a bunch of Lucky Craft cranks in the mouth of a fish that breaks off.

The other advantage I see in co-poly is increased abrasion resistance over mono, again I think this permits going to a thinner line. I understand you have the additional problem of toothy critters in your water, but I also catch an occasional muskie and the lines I use gets them to the boat (or kayak) without major issues.

Finally, I understand it's all about preferences, confidence, and who your sponsors are - any one here have a sponsor? Man, I wish I did. But for me, I go as light as I can and that is 10# for reaction baits and 12# for plastics, like you - just two line strengths - and in a good co-polymer. The advantages over mono are important in my fishing. I admit, I have tried heavier line - 15#, 17# and even gone to 20# and 25# co-poly for fishing jigs in heavy cover. I did not like it at all, I found the heavier line more difficult to use in the type/style of fishing I do.

So, that's me and I know I don't have even half the answers. But I am not one who thinks going (to) heavier (line) would improve my fishing experience in my local water. When I go south, I do increase my line strength (again, we are talking about co-poly), going to 12# and 15#, but you won't find me using non-braided line in strength above those, I just do not see an advantage, only more problems.

So, let the debate begin. Heavier or ligher line?

Last edited by bassboogieman; 09-19-12 at 11:58 AM.
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Old 09-19-12, 02:13 PM   #3
keithdog
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bassboogieman View Post
I don't know about fishing stratigies - but my friend, your posting stratagy should include PARAGRAPHS, so they can be more easily read and understood.

Can I ask a dumb question? OK, thanks, I will. First let me stipulate - I am NOT a tournament angler and every fish I catch, or do not catch, does not impact my fininacial balance sheet or anything else. Why do you feel the need to increase your line weight, particularyly in the non-braid line? I am exactly oppisite in my thinking. Regarding braid and why I exclude it from the decision to go heavier, it's thinner and I find anything under 20# difficult to cast, resulting in wind knots, loops on the end of the rod, digging in the spool, etc., so heavier test for braid I fully understand.

In the instance of co-poly, which we both seem to prefer, most are thinner than mono and therefore "stronger" in lines of similiar diameter - which is how Yo-Zuri (my preference, but I also use some of the P-LIne Fluroclear) is rated as to "line test" on the spool. I see you get the line diameter vs strength differential between co-poly and mono, but the choice to use co-poly in a similiar diameter as mono and gain strength, is directly opposite of my choice to maintain strength while reducing line "size". The other issue I have with "heavy" line (other than braid) is the managabilty of it on the reel. I've found the heavier (co-poly especially) is pretty stiff and has more memory issues, the lighter lines are bad enough.

Secondly, you and I fish northern water (mostly) and our bass are by a large margin under 5# on average. Now, if I was fishing southern water then I would increase my line strength in anticipation of catching something considerably larger. I choose co-poly for a couple reasons, the main one would be that it allows me to use a line of similiar strength with a smaller diameter (size, compared to mono) and that allows me to get a bait deeper and has less effect on a diving baits action. I think the heavier line does effect the action of a crankbait, so I want to use the smallest line I can without leaving a bunch of Lucky Craft cranks in the mouth of a fish that breaks off.

The other advantage I see in co-poly is increased abrasion resistance over mono, again I think this permits going to a thinner line. I understand you have the additional problem of toothy critters in your water, but I also catch an occasional muskie and the lines I use gets them to the boat (or kayak) without major issues.

Finally, I understand it's all about preferences, confidence, and who your sponsors are - any one here have a sponsor? Man, I wish I did. But for me, I go as light as I can and that is 10# for reaction baits and 12# for plastics, like you - just two line strengths - and in a good co-polymer. The advantages over mono are important in my fishing. I admit, I have tried heavier line - 15#, 17# and even gone to 20# and 25# co-poly for fishing jigs in heavy cover. I did not like it at all, I found the heavier line more difficult to use in the type/style of fishing I do.

So, that's me and I know I don't have even half the answers. But I am not one who thinks going (to) heavier (line) would improve my fishing experience in my local water. When I go south, I do increase my line strength (again, we are talking about co-poly), going to 12# and 15#, but you won't find me using non-braided line in strength above those, I just do not see an advantage, only more problems.

So, let the debate begin. Heavier or ligher line?
Wow, that a lot to respond to! hahaha I hadn't meant to start a line debate with this post. I do agree with you on the paragraphs though. Point well taken. I'll try to clarify my choices.

I understand what your saying about line diameter for copoly being smaller than mono, so why go up? Firstly, I have never had an issue casting with heavier lines. And I've not found heavier copolys to have handling or stiffness issues. I've only used 2 though. SilverThread which I loved but can't find anymore, and Floroclear which I also love. But if I can increase the strength of my line and not sacrifice line diameter, why not? If Floroclear was available in 17 pound test, I might stick with that, but it's not. It's just more reassurance the line will handle the fight without breakage when I'm trying to haul a 5 pound bass through a snarl of tree limbs, or out from under a pier when it's wrapped the line around a support post. And that gives me more confidence to reach in and go after those bass that are in tight to heavy cover and not be as concerned with my line. There was a time when 14 pound was the heaviest line I would use, and 10 pound was a line I used a lot. I also had many more breakoffs back then than I do today.

Secondly, I have always prefered 12 pound line for most of my crankbait needs. I like 15 for shallow and larger cranks as I explained for various reasons, but have always felt 12 pound line is a very good average for crankbaits, and all my cranks perform flawlessly on 12 pound line. And since the Floroclear 15# line is basically the same as 12# mono, it's an easy choice to make. Like I said, I'm rarely ever trying to get my cranks deeper than 18 foot. Usually far less than that, so a thinner diameter line to reach deeper water isn't a concern of mine. However, when I do hang up a Lucky Craft on a submerged log or stump, I'll be glad to have that heavier line to try to get it back with.

I'm not saying this is the right thing to do for me or anyone else. But it's my way of simplifying my line choice, and one I think I will be happy with. The more I can concentrate on my fishing and not my tackle, the better the total experience will be. It's going to be my experiment for 2013. I'll see if it works or fails. I know I won't be in a possition where I'd like to toss a bait into a certain target but thought twice about it because of the line weight I had rigged on that rod.
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Old 09-19-12, 04:17 PM   #4
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OK, I'm chewing on that. Everyone has different preferences, for sure.
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Old 09-19-12, 10:50 PM   #5
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Holy crap that's a lot of thought about line. I use 8# for spinning, 12# for crankbaits and clear water lakes and 14# for everything else. I keep my line simple and it works for me. I started fishing a drop shot and shaky head more this year and caught a lot of fish on it so I will probably spend more time next year with a spinning rod in my hand.
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Old 09-19-12, 11:10 PM   #6
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One thing I'd keep in mind Keith the depth of you cranks. If you're used to throwing a deep crank in 12 feet of water and hitting the bottom, you might not be dragging the bottom as long, so you might have to get slightly deeper cranks to compensate!

Hope everything works well for ya though Keith, good luck!
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Old 09-21-12, 08:47 PM   #7
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I want to improve my concentration and patience.
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Old 09-21-12, 09:17 PM   #8
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Quote:
I want to improve my concentration and patience.
If you're going to set a goal - set it high. But really, I know when I put up one that has no way of being met, but you're young yet, we'll just give it a little time. Maybe by 2035 you might make it...................
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Old 09-21-12, 09:59 PM   #9
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New strategies for 2013?

I am going to devote at least one or two 8 hour fishing days a month to freelining live fresh caught 4-5" bluegills. No lead no bobber nothing but a 1/0 tru turn impaled from chin through nostril, a little breeze and off we go. Purist be damned.
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Old 09-21-12, 10:18 PM   #10
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If you're going to set a goal - set it high. But really, I know when I put up one that has no way of being met, but you're young yet, we'll just give it a little time. Maybe by 2035 you might make it...................

I think what I posted is a more tangible goal that learning...some technique. But I want to try and get better from a mindset standpoint, and see how that impacts my strategy and effectiveness.
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Old 09-21-12, 10:48 PM   #11
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I think what I posted is a more tangible goal that learning...some technique. But I want to try and get better from a mindset standpoint, and see how that impacts my strategy and effectiveness.
I have to agree with you. At some point you know how to use your equipment and work your baits, the mental side of fishing is what seperates good fishermen from average fishermen.
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Old 09-21-12, 10:56 PM   #12
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Oh, sorry. You WERE being serious. My bad. I am seldom serious myself anymore, so I sometimes have difficulty recognizing when someone is being serious.

So, being serious a moment, a serious question Mr. Love: As a kayak and recreational fisherman - as opposed to tournament angler - myself, and I believe you are mostly a recreational fisherman as well, do you really find yourself in need of improving your concentration and patience? In my instance, since I've gotten to enjoy the kayak so much in comparison to the boat. I've found my concentration and what little patience I have, has improved purely by fishing from the kayak, more like a natural order of things.

The testing of my patience has greatly diminished as I am ALONE, there is no one on the back deck, as with the boat, that I have to consider or better said - deal with. That imporves my patience considerably as there really is little to test it. Same with concentration - in the kayak my focus is solely on fishing, not worried about the trolling motor, boat position, not tripping over the dozen rods on the deck, etc, etc. Certainly there is a break in the concentration as I move about, but when the bait hits the water, it has all my attention - I can't do that when I'm on the front deck.

Those two things, for me, are much less of a concern when I'm in the kayak than in the boat. It's just a more natural thing for me, when in the kayak, my concentration and patience is at a higher level - when speaking about the fishing aspect - as it's not impacted by other concerns when operating a boat with someone else aboard.

I know you put a lot into your fishing, but I'm just curious about the level of C & P you're referring to. My goal would be to reach a level of Nirvana in fishing where I would not have to concentrate, or be very patient, it would all occur naturally as a result of putting a bait in the water, and fishing would approach something of a Zen experience. I know I could never acheive that level in a bass boat, but I believe it possible in a kayak. Naa nna nnaan nahhhhhhhhh..............
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Old 09-21-12, 11:18 PM   #13
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One thing about fishing a kayak is you are at the mercy of the current, your paddling, or rudimentary methods of anchoring. Remember I fish a lot of rivers that move - some with rapids. Worrying about where you are drifting within the next 25 seconds has a real tendency to divide my concentration. And also, just the physical exertion involved in paddling a couple miles downstream, makes me a little more lazy than I might otherwise be.

I also think that sometimes I go through the motions, picking easy techniques such as spinnerbaits, cranks, as opposed to jigs, carolina rigs and stuff that is proven but not quick. Part of that again, is because there is a window of casting where you are likely to be blown or pushed out of position by current, so you need a lure that moves.

I also for years have wanted to learn to fish offshore structure, taking advantage of that depth finder thingy for more than pure curiosity. It will take patience and dedication to do so.

For me, it is still purely recreational...but as a higher recreation, I want to make this into an art. That requires the best I can offer, which is something to this point I have not given.


----------------------------------

Perfectly reasonable that you didnt think I was serous. My last post was about a national weather service elite commando outpost in georgia.
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Old 09-21-12, 11:29 PM   #14
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Also thought I should mention, I want to try and catch some carp and redfish on a fly, maybe a few other different fish depending on what I do post school.
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Old 09-21-12, 11:41 PM   #15
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OK, got that. I kinda forgot we fish different water and our kayaks are DEFINITELY different. I rarely touch a paddle, and don't have the physical demands associated with paddling in currnet. I do fish tidal water so I get some of that, but with the drive system, I'm not picking up and using a paddle, I just pedal a little and keep fishing as I do so. The pedal/rudder operation is a secondary, almost a sub-consious thing at this point unless I am actually headed somewhere. Thanks for clearing that up, I think I understand your point better.
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Old 09-22-12, 09:24 AM   #16
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Aint ever had no need to bounce a frog offa da bottom in 17 ft of water,make a commotion an makem come up,what paragraphs easier to type all in one straight line do you fellers read weird.
Nowhere did I read about bouncing a bubblegum pink frog off bridge pilings,some where I have failed in my job.About the only ones one can find anymore are Sumo.
Lastly emergency paddle and try not to use-150 hp put foot down.
Must admit came close to getting a 250 dollar wal mart job(yak) as like the west obion canals and lakes no ramps,tired of wading and chock full of cottonmouths.
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Old 09-22-12, 10:52 AM   #17
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Try the kayak, mule - I would almost guarnatee you would not regret it. Not that it takes the place of a boat, but opens more opportunities. They are just the ticket for a quiet, relaxing morning on the water for those days when dragging out the boat just seems too much of a hassle.
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