What the H*** is the real reason?

joedog · 10-19-11, 05:45 PM

Ok I can tell the cold has started because my thoughts are all ready switching to the spring opener. You southeners who have open game fish year round may not understand this concept, but here in Wi. inland water game fishing is closed from March 4th til May 8th. Like the title asks:
What the h*** is the reason?
Now I understand this concept may help Walleyes or pike who spawn earlier but as for bass, the opener coincides directly with the start of bass starting the move shallow to make beds. In reality the start of the Bass' most vulnerable time of the year. And Walleye fishing is more river fishing than inland water fishing (especially waters with dams like the Mississippi and Wisconsin river systems) and running water is usually exempt from seasons (open year round). Yes I know Walleyes are prominant in alot of Minn. lakes and some big Wi. lakes but growing up on the Mississippi River, dams usually will out fish lakes in spring 50 to 1. So what is the purpose of this closed season? Makes absolutely no sense to me at all. Now, Nortern Wi. has a catch and release only during early spawn and this makes sense but why is this time frame March 5th to May 7th choosen to close inland waters. Dose anyone have any ideas on this concept?

islandbass · 10-19-11, 05:59 PM

Just you call your state's fish and wildlife office and find out. I would take their word over anybody's "opinion".

My state has some similar rules. Fishing season starts the last Saturday of April. Not as late as your state, but it still sucks!

Bassboss · 10-19-11, 06:32 PM

I'd love to know why as well. It's a real pain in the *** to sit and look at fishable water day-in and day-out but is at the same time unfishable due to season.

Didn't know that it excluded moving waters, I'll hace to contract my DNR to see if the rivers I fish are open.

Marty · 10-19-11, 08:00 PM

Like the man said, call the office and ask. But it's hard to imagine any answer other than protection of the fishery.

Here in New York bass season was always closed from December 1 until the 3rd Saturday in June. It was illegal to fish for them out of season, even on a catch-and-release basis. I always wondered what New York knew that others didn't, because in every bordering state fishing was allowed for 12 months, even though some of them had closed seasons when you couldn't keep them.

Well, on December 1, 2006, the state relaxed things and allowed catch and release during the closed season. It's the best thing that's ever happened to me, fishingwise. However, it's still illegal to target other out-of-season fish, such as walleye and pike.

Just because a state has reasons for their regulations doesn't mean that they're all correct. I checked once and I think it was 43 or 44 states had no closed season. I'm not aware of any of them making things more restrictive because 12 months was ruining the fishery.

joedog · 10-19-11, 08:41 PM

I called and they really couldn't or wouldn't give a reason other than thats the law. Called DNR same result. Thats why I asked here because your knowledge is far superior than anyone around here.

nofearengineer · 10-19-11, 08:50 PM

The real reason is it gives authoritarians in government and those who lobby them the illusion that they can control nature. That and the reality that they can control other humans' lives.

joedog · 10-19-11, 09:29 PM

With a little surfing this is what I found at another site
From what I understand culling and seasons are in place from the 1950's-60's when fisheries were being decimated by recreational anglers. The season was put in place for one reason, over harvest during the spawn. The no-cull rule was put in place after harvest limits because back in the day before livewells fisherman were returning all their smaller cull fish which were dead back to the lake.

joedog · 10-20-11, 06:19 AM

I also found out that only Wi. and Minn. still have open and closed seasons. Mi. is now catch and release which makes alot more sense, IMO. What about Il.?

Bender · 10-20-11, 09:46 AM

joedog, MI still has a closed season. Catch and Immediate Release (CIR) starts the last weekend of April and goes until the last weekend in May when the full season opens. From January 1 through the last weekend in April the season is completely closed. The only reason the DNR has given is because it would be hard to enforce the closed walleye/pike season while bass season is open.

Also in New York state the decision for bass seasons was left up to district managers for the DEC. I lived in Saranac Lake and my county was on the edge of a district that was closed until June. Of course all the lakes were in the closed area, but 5 minutes away the area had an open season. What complete nonsense!

When living in New York I did a lot of research and wrote letters to several people in the DEC to try to get this changed. I think that I was one of about 3 total bass anglers in the whole district so they didn't seem to care.

There have been numerous studies done on the impact of CIR on spawning bass and with the exception of one Canadian study, there has been no negative impact found on the bass population. These laws are archaic and need to be removed. I get extremely frustrated with this because it seems like I have not been able to get anywhere as a single person and I don't have time/know how to organize a group to fight this. I think the only way is if the TBF and/or BASS Federation pushed for a change, but they don't seem to care; probably because they generally don't do catch and release tournaments so they won't make any money. (< my opinion) It took 31 years for B.A.S.S. to get Wisconsin's silly culling laws changed and they only did it because of the potential to make money. As a non-tournament angler I do not feel that these organizations do anything to help me and I have so far not found any group that is concerned with, and actively doing something about the concerns of bass fishermen that aren't concerned with tournaments.

To sum things up, I see red when I think about these laws and generally disregard them on personal grounds of civil disobedience. I do not flaunt breaking these laws or post on public forums about breaking the law since that would be dumb and asking for trouble. If I am caught I am prepared to hire a lawyer and go to court or just pay the ticket.

WatterBoy · 10-20-11, 11:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bender

. . . It took 31 years for B.A.S.S. to get Wisconsin's silly culling laws changed . . .

This new WI law applies only to tournaments, right? As soon as a non-tourney fisherman puts a bass in their livewell, even if they release it later, it still counts against their daily limit, right? Or am I misunderstanding the new law?

3dkicker · 10-20-11, 12:22 PM

I'll go with old laws that are on the book and people not wanting to change them. Here in VA we have old blue laws in effect and aren't allowed to deer hunt on Sunday's. I guess the deer are in church and they don't want hunters setting up stands in the church parking lots. People are now looking to change it and it might go through.....

We had a 12-15" slot limit on Lake Anna for years but no scientific data to support the limit. Finally someone questioned game and fish about the limit and asked for it to be reviewed. They found no reason to have the limit and removed it. That's all it took. One person to request that the rule/law be reviewed.

Dogmatic · 10-21-11, 12:41 PM

@Bender, ever try local clubs, it might be a start. Here in PA we have a closed season, but with CR, and you can't intentionally fish for bedding bass.

Bender · 10-21-11, 02:08 PM

All of the local clubs that I have found are tournament based. They have monthly meetings in off months but tournaments are their only meetings most of the year. There is one club which I'd like to look into, but as a new member I think it would be difficult to try to join and right away get everybody fired up enough to do something. Also I travel for work and am on call 24/7 so I can't seem to make regular meetings. Maybe I should shut up and start my own group.

Dogmatic · 10-22-11, 08:04 AM

I lurk on a couple "local" fishing websites, and it's amazing how you can get members from those sites motivated...We just managed to win access to a Lake that was "scheduled" to have it's only public ramp closed. Someone posted all the information needed to petition the PFBC, they recieved over 1000 petitions just from the site alone, and the D-head landowner got screwd, and the public won!

bamabassman · 10-22-11, 09:14 AM

good for oyu guys dog!!!

10-19-11, 05:45 PM	#1
joedog BassFishin.Com Super Veteran Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: JANESVILLE,WI. 53545 Posts: 3,415	What the H* is the real reason? Ok I can tell the cold has started because my thoughts are all ready switching to the spring opener. You southeners who have open game fish year round may not understand this concept, but here in Wi. inland water game fishing is closed from March 4th til May 8th. Like the title asks: What the h* is the reason? Now I understand this concept may help Walleyes or pike who spawn earlier but as for bass, the opener coincides directly with the start of bass starting the move shallow to make beds. In reality the start of the Bass' most vulnerable time of the year. And Walleye fishing is more river fishing than inland water fishing (especially waters with dams like the Mississippi and Wisconsin river systems) and running water is usually exempt from seasons (open year round). Yes I know Walleyes are prominant in alot of Minn. lakes and some big Wi. lakes but growing up on the Mississippi River, dams usually will out fish lakes in spring 50 to 1. So what is the purpose of this closed season? Makes absolutely no sense to me at all. Now, Nortern Wi. has a catch and release only during early spawn and this makes sense but why is this time frame March 5th to May 7th choosen to close inland waters. Dose anyone have any ideas on this concept?

10-19-11, 05:59 PM	#2
islandbass BassFishin.Com Super Veteran Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: WA State Posts: 1,783	Just you call your state's fish and wildlife office and find out. I would take their word over anybody's "opinion". My state has some similar rules. Fishing season starts the last Saturday of April. Not as late as your state, but it still sucks! __________________ ARX "If people concentrated on the really important things in life, there'd be a shortage of fishing poles." Doug Larson (Shimano 2005 Reel Catalog)

10-19-11, 06:32 PM	#3
Bassboss BassFishin.Com Premier Elite Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Shawano, WI Posts: 7,761	I'd love to know why as well. It's a real pain in the *** to sit and look at fishable water day-in and day-out but is at the same time unfishable due to season. Didn't know that it excluded moving waters, I'll hace to contract my DNR to see if the rivers I fish are open. __________________ If you can't fix it with heavy squats or fish oil, you're probably going to die.

10-19-11, 08:00 PM	#4
Marty BassFishin.Com Super Veteran Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Rochester, NY Posts: 1,580	Like the man said, call the office and ask. But it's hard to imagine any answer other than protection of the fishery. Here in New York bass season was always closed from December 1 until the 3rd Saturday in June. It was illegal to fish for them out of season, even on a catch-and-release basis. I always wondered what New York knew that others didn't, because in every bordering state fishing was allowed for 12 months, even though some of them had closed seasons when you couldn't keep them. Well, on December 1, 2006, the state relaxed things and allowed catch and release during the closed season. It's the best thing that's ever happened to me, fishingwise. However, it's still illegal to target other out-of-season fish, such as walleye and pike. Just because a state has reasons for their regulations doesn't mean that they're all correct. I checked once and I think it was 43 or 44 states had no closed season. I'm not aware of any of them making things more restrictive because 12 months was ruining the fishery. __________________ Meeting expenses is easy...they're EVERYWHERE The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits Rochester, NY

10-19-11, 08:50 PM	#6
nofearengineer BassFishin.Com Premier Elite Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Southwest IN Posts: 5,630	The real reason is it gives authoritarians in government and those who lobby them the illusion that they can control nature. That and the reality that they can control other humans' lives. __________________ Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing it is not fish they are after.

10-19-11, 08:41 PM	#5
joedog BassFishin.Com Super Veteran Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: JANESVILLE,WI. 53545 Posts: 3,415	I called and they really couldn't or wouldn't give a reason other than thats the law. Called DNR same result. Thats why I asked here because your knowledge is far superior than anyone around here.

10-19-11, 09:29 PM	#7
joedog BassFishin.Com Super Veteran Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: JANESVILLE,WI. 53545 Posts: 3,415	With a little surfing this is what I found at another site From what I understand culling and seasons are in place from the 1950's-60's when fisheries were being decimated by recreational anglers. The season was put in place for one reason, over harvest during the spawn. The no-cull rule was put in place after harvest limits because back in the day before livewells fisherman were returning all their smaller cull fish which were dead back to the lake.

10-20-11, 06:19 AM	#8
joedog BassFishin.Com Super Veteran Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: JANESVILLE,WI. 53545 Posts: 3,415	I also found out that only Wi. and Minn. still have open and closed seasons. Mi. is now catch and release which makes alot more sense, IMO. What about Il.?

10-20-11, 09:46 AM	#9
Bender BassFishin.Com Super Veteran Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Brighton, MI Posts: 2,414	joedog, MI still has a closed season. Catch and Immediate Release (CIR) starts the last weekend of April and goes until the last weekend in May when the full season opens. From January 1 through the last weekend in April the season is completely closed. The only reason the DNR has given is because it would be hard to enforce the closed walleye/pike season while bass season is open. Also in New York state the decision for bass seasons was left up to district managers for the DEC. I lived in Saranac Lake and my county was on the edge of a district that was closed until June. Of course all the lakes were in the closed area, but 5 minutes away the area had an open season. What complete nonsense! When living in New York I did a lot of research and wrote letters to several people in the DEC to try to get this changed. I think that I was one of about 3 total bass anglers in the whole district so they didn't seem to care. There have been numerous studies done on the impact of CIR on spawning bass and with the exception of one Canadian study, there has been no negative impact found on the bass population. These laws are archaic and need to be removed. I get extremely frustrated with this because it seems like I have not been able to get anywhere as a single person and I don't have time/know how to organize a group to fight this. I think the only way is if the TBF and/or BASS Federation pushed for a change, but they don't seem to care; probably because they generally don't do catch and release tournaments so they won't make any money. (< my opinion) It took 31 years for B.A.S.S. to get Wisconsin's silly culling laws changed and they only did it because of the potential to make money. As a non-tournament angler I do not feel that these organizations do anything to help me and I have so far not found any group that is concerned with, and actively doing something about the concerns of bass fishermen that aren't concerned with tournaments. To sum things up, I see red when I think about these laws and generally disregard them on personal grounds of civil disobedience. I do not flaunt breaking these laws or post on public forums about breaking the law since that would be dumb and asking for trouble. If I am caught I am prepared to hire a lawyer and go to court or just pay the ticket.

10-20-11, 12:22 PM	#11
3dkicker BassFishin.Com Super Veteran Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Spotsylvania, VA Posts: 4,483	I'll go with old laws that are on the book and people not wanting to change them. Here in VA we have old blue laws in effect and aren't allowed to deer hunt on Sunday's. I guess the deer are in church and they don't want hunters setting up stands in the church parking lots. People are now looking to change it and it might go through..... We had a 12-15" slot limit on Lake Anna for years but no scientific data to support the limit. Finally someone questioned game and fish about the limit and asked for it to be reviewed. They found no reason to have the limit and removed it. That's all it took. One person to request that the rule/law be reviewed. __________________ Smitty www.smittystubes.com

10-21-11, 12:41 PM	#12
Dogmatic BassFishin.Com Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Bucks County, PA Posts: 714	@Bender, ever try local clubs, it might be a start. Here in PA we have a closed season, but with CR, and you can't intentionally fish for bedding bass.

10-21-11, 02:08 PM	#13
Bender BassFishin.Com Super Veteran Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Brighton, MI Posts: 2,414	All of the local clubs that I have found are tournament based. They have monthly meetings in off months but tournaments are their only meetings most of the year. There is one club which I'd like to look into, but as a new member I think it would be difficult to try to join and right away get everybody fired up enough to do something. Also I travel for work and am on call 24/7 so I can't seem to make regular meetings. Maybe I should shut up and start my own group.

10-22-11, 08:04 AM	#14
Dogmatic BassFishin.Com Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Bucks County, PA Posts: 714	I lurk on a couple "local" fishing websites, and it's amazing how you can get members from those sites motivated...We just managed to win access to a Lake that was "scheduled" to have it's only public ramp closed. Someone posted all the information needed to petition the PFBC, they recieved over 1000 petitions just from the site alone, and the D-head landowner got screwd, and the public won!

10-22-11, 09:14 AM	#15
bamabassman BassFishin.Com Premier Elite Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: cedar bluff, alabama Posts: 15,292	good for oyu guys dog!!! __________________ so many lures, so little time.

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