Bassfishing message boards and magazines are a bad thing...

[WTL]

I figured its time to propose a question, can there be such a thing as too much specific information in regards to how-to-do whatever when it comes to fishing?

What prompted this thought was a section in an old book, The Philosophical Fisherman written by Harold Blaisdale where he talks about how he got more enjoyment he thinks out of learning to catch fish with a bent needle and sewing thread, having no prior ideas on the proper ways of taking trout (and hence no worries if he was doing it the right way). He thought he learned more about fish behavoir through observation.


Today, before kids even catch fish, some are wearing the stupid tourney style clothing (see the ad for the kid sized rods in the BPS catolog, even though he is like 8 I still want to punch that kid in the gut for looking like some tournament wantabe superstar douche)... are we putting the cart before the horse here? Would kids be better off with a cane pole they cut themselves and some crickets they managed to scrounge up in a dark place around their home?



Should we take a kid fishing?

[BigBassin144]

Originally Posted by WTL

Would kids be better off with a cane pole they cut themselves and some crickets they managed to scrounge up in a dark place around their home?

Ok, I do agree with you some, but I think that may be taking it a little too far. Sure I grew up fishing with worms or grasshopper I caught myself, but a lot of kids nowdays are obsessed with instant gratification, as are a lot of people period. I grew up fishing (not just for bass) and now I've loved learning to fish for bass and this message board and magazines help me to learn more things and become a more rounded fisherman.

As for fishing with a cane pole, you can't beat it! It's just too much fun. Although I don't know about fishing with one I cut myself. (I don't think there are any trees on our property big enough)


BB

[lunker-lander]

Originally Posted by WTL

Today, before kids even catch fish, some are wearing the stupid tourney style clothing (see the ad for the kid sized rods in the BPS catolog, even though he is like 8 I still want to punch that kid in the gut for looking like some tournament wantabe superstar douche)...

Should we take a kid fishing?

As to your question - yes! Take a kid fishing; but first show guts over glory. Not all fisherman become a professional. He/she need to know this first and foremost.

Anyway, I really liked this part I quoted. I see kids like this all the time on TV, in magazines, etc. You see them all decked-out in the top-dollar clothing thinking that they can land a lunker like there is no tomorrow. I just wanna reach through the media and show that little sum***** a thing or two. The damn kids never caught a fish and he's already dressed like a professional. Just goes to show Daddy's got more dollars than sense...

-Lunk-

[BigBassin144]

The people in catalogs probably aren't even fishermen. They're just good looking people paid to pretend to fish. and honestly I think they'd sell more if they cut out pictures from SI's swinsuit issues and glued them on the pages with the fishing stuff.



BB

[pignjig]

WTL- torelaxandenjoy's signature quote says a lot about that subject. Hopefully not too much information here- I am a Freemason and we have a saying "Real Masons recognize each other." IMO, the same holds true for anglers. We had a guy who tried to get into our club years ago. He showed up at the Open tournament with a vest that he'd sewn every manufacturer's patch on he could find and he talked a big game. He ended up getting skunked. Normally, all of us would have thought nothing of it and welcomed him. But, because of the "there's no there-there" of the guy, he soon left and we never saw him again. I surely hope, as I believe you do as well, that the shallowness that has corrupted so many other sports just by-passes bass fishing. It's already poking it's foul snout out of it's corporate lair-- All it takes for that beast to be loosed is for good men (and women) to do nothing.

I will ask this question, though: When I was a kid, I wanted to be a cowboy. I had a cowboy suit and gunbelt just like millions of other kids. Is there a difference between a 1973 rugrat wanting to be the Lone Ranger and a 2008 crumsnatcher wanting to be Zell Rowland?

I always appreciate your philosophical bent.

-Pig

[Rebbasser]

Great question, Billy. I think it all boils down to your roots. I started perch jerking with a cane pole and nightcrawlers, like many folks did. I always got a thrill watching that bobber dance. I get the same thrill when I feel that thump or the rod loads when a fish hammers my bait.

Should we take kids fishing? Heck yes! But if they have never been before forego all the fancy gear and grab a cane pole and a can of nightcrawlers. If the addiction takes, years down the road he/she will look back on it taking root with a cane pole , a dancing bobber, and a nightcrawler.

They won't fish for fish-they will fish for fishin'. You boys know exactly what I mean.

[carolina-rig-01]

reb i couldn't agree more. instead of brow beating them by telling them they aren't gonna fish for a living when they grow up. i think it would be better to keep it simple and fun while emphasizing (sp?) that there is a lot more to it than catching fish. then if they want to dream of fishing for a living when they grow up that's awesome! maybe he could get dad a lot of cool stuff from his sponsors lol.

[bassinbob]

Hey pignjig, how old is your grandmother?

[Patrick Krueger, Jr.]

They should feature those kids barefoot in straw hats and overalls folded up to there knees napping with the line tied around their toe so they know when the got a bite, like Tom Sawyer.

[WTL]

I will ask this question, though: When I was a kid, I wanted to be a cowboy. I had a cowboy suit and gunbelt just like millions of other kids. Is there a difference between a 1973 rugrat wanting to be the Lone Ranger and a 2008 crumsnatcher wanting to be Zell Rowland?

PigNJig,
why did the kid from '73 want to be the Lone Ranger? Was it because of the cool uniform, or the lofty ideals that the Ranger represented? I submit to you that the uniform was just clothing, as was the image, but if he had a good heart then aspiring to be like the Lone Ranger was a good thing. The same is true for Zell Rowland. The kid shouldn't aspire to be Zell Rowland so that others want to be him, so that he can ride around in a fancy boat or even so he can win. But if life is good for Zell Rowland, if Zell derives peace from his career, then it is good for kids to want to be like him. Just as long as they don't wanna be like Bill Dance society will survive.

I'm not really coming down against professionalism in fishing. I'm just wondering aloud if something isn't lost in how some people go about things.

I learned fishing from my Dad. He is a two trick angler, on one rod a Nip-I-Didee propbait, on the other a worm. He derives his enjoyment from going, getting out there and the possibility of lucking into a fish. No pressure. I'm somewhere in the middle, as many here may know I do appreciate advances in tackle and tactics, but the sun on my back and the chance to beat the water is still 95% of the enjoyment for me. Its probably why I could never be a pro tournament angler, even though fishing is a way of life.

[Cranebird]

It is the worst thing in the world. I am glad it wasn't around when I started fishing.When I was a kid we had little tackle shops everywhere.Today there is Bass pro shops, Cabelas, Gander Mountain.......The little local tackle shops have folded up one by one. You can say the big shops are great but they aren't really so great.
Try to talk to the person behind the counter for a couple of hours after buying a bottle of Cherry crush soda & a skybar,a pack of black ditto worms and a pack of mister twister phenom worms. Point blank, they aren't going to and most people who work there don't know anything about fishing at all anyway.

In saying that.......

Hands down, this site is the greatest bassin forum going.Kevin deserves more praise than he will ever get for keeping this site up and running for us to use.Thank You Kevin.

This site has the advantage of drastically reducing the time spent out on the water to learn what can be learned right here from those who share thier knowledge.

Its a double edged sword ,I love Kevins site but I truely hate the marketing end of the internet business. Its like they need to find something new for us to devour off the shelfs without knowing if it will in fact catch fish or not, our trend is geared to something new rather than the old proven lures.I wish I could still walk into the tiny cluttered tackle shops and buy Cherry/orange crush soda, skybars and the black ditto worm.

Sorry to ramble. C-Bird

[lunker-lander]

Originally Posted by Cranebird

In saying that.......

Hands down, this site is the greatest bassin forum going.Kevin deserves more praise than he will ever get for keeping this site up and running for us to use.Thank You Kevin.

Amen!

-Lunk-

[crankybait]

If kid aren't introduced to fishing, the future generations will lack fisherman, and be filled with TV-watching X-box Playing couch potatoes. Kids should be introduced to fishing, just in the right way. Not immediately put into the world of expensive gear and different strategies. I'll be the first to admit, I dont go all nuts over conditions and what to use when. I use what I'm confident in and feel like using. Why do I fish crankbaits? I hardly ever catch on them... but I enjoy that little wiggle feel I get in the rod handle when I fish them. I guess at young ages, fishing should be for fun and relaxation rather than obsessive competition and trying to be a pro.

[pignjig]

WTL- I think we're taking two different tacts because I completely agree with you. After reading your post again, I believe I read it incorrectly. We're on the same page. Hey, what if that kid wanted to be Ru Paul? Oy!

-Pig

[torelaxandenjoy]

WTL. When I was in school and just a youth (fisher of brats), my main baits were the Red Devil and the Hula Popper, then as I got older I went to live bait and dough balls, now when I go out with my son I am using lures, live and artificial worms and dough balls!!!!!!!!!! God only knows what I would be using if I had grand kids. The real enjoyment is being one with nature wheter I snag some thing or not.

Originally Posted by WTL

PigNJig,
why did the kid from '73 want to be the Lone Ranger? Was it because of the cool uniform, or the lofty ideals that the Ranger represented? I submit to you that the uniform was just clothing, as was the image, but if he had a good heart then aspiring to be like the Lone Ranger was a good thing. The same is true for Zell Rowland. The kid shouldn't aspire to be Zell Rowland so that others want to be him, so that he can ride around in a fancy boat or even so he can win. But if life is good for Zell Rowland, if Zell derives peace from his career, then it is good for kids to want to be like him. Just as long as they don't wanna be like Bill Dance society will survive.

I'm not really coming down against professionalism in fishing. I'm just wondering aloud if something isn't lost in how some people go about things.

I learned fishing from my Dad. He is a two trick angler, on one rod a Nip-I-Didee propbait, on the other a worm. He derives his enjoyment from going, getting out there and the possibility of lucking into a fish. No pressure. I'm somewhere in the middle, as many here may know I do appreciate advances in tackle and tactics, but the sun on my back and the chance to beat the water is still 95% of the enjoyment for me. Its probably why I could never be a pro tournament angler, even though fishing is a way of life.

[fishin' fool]

I do think alot of kids now adays are missing the point when it comes to fishing, and skipping the essential basics of knowing habits and behaviors of fish! And I think that is from media/tv coverage of hot trends, baits, and patterns. Its always funny to see kids and even adults fish baits that and trends like frog, jig worm, and cranks that have been very productive since the 60-70's.

[zooker]

i grew up in a house of big water trout anglers. i was piloting massive fishing vessels before i could drive a car..while my first fish was a trout.
i was a fly swatter so no cane poles for me..

i fish for bass as i have a need to pit wits against a worthy oppnent. as with trout color,depth,presention still apply. i have the ability to catch at least one fish every time i go..think about this statement a mintue...

i use these sites as a way to pass on information to a young generation..

as a good friend says there are "fisherman" and there are poeple who think they are fisherman. this line is easily seen.

zooker

[Fish2win]

For the last 14 years I have been an outdoor writer in a local newspaper here. I have written lots of articles about lots of fishing topics. Writing has taught me this. There are no absolutes in fishing. I have been a bass fisherman for 45 years and have learned a lot from the fish that has been contridicted in many publications. With-in thier eco system bass have free right of choice. Most articles you read are someones opinion. There is really very little scientific proof of much that is pinned in mags,newspapers or message boards. Example; last month i was catching smallmouth in 4 feet of water on a DT6. Your could not crank it fast enough to take it away from them. The water temp was 46degrees. Everyone knows that at that temp the fish are real slow, suspended on channel breaks and in general not real active. Did I mention that I was also in the back of a creek. Most of what you read is entertainment. Some fact but mostly circumstantial at best. The greatest thing you can do is remember that the fish dont read use the internet or watch fishing shows. They dont care what brand your bait or rod or boat are. Keep an open mind and let experience and the fish tell you what they want and where they want it.Fish2win

[bamabassman]

well stated fish2win. but i also think that things are getting out of portion a bit. like nascar for instance, don't get mad gang. it is just that i am not a big fan of todays racing. and yes i am gonna include college football, as well as all sports. everything is going too fast today. we need to slow down and get back to the root of sport i think. all sports. everything in life in general. we get caught up in the hoopla too much, sit back and enjoy the time we have. relax and fish slowly. i try to , it don't always work, haha, but i try to relax and enjoy the day on the water.

[Lilmoosecountry]

What ever get's a kids fishing is fine with me. We need to perserve this sport. So what ever put's a pole in there hand is fine with me. They can dress however up the way they want if it get's them on the water.

[BassMoJo]

Until that kid grows up then if it sticks like it did with us .... here we are.

[Fish2win]

Guys I have real concerns for our sport. My bass boat gets 4 MPG tops. My truck when I am pulling it gets 16. gas is 325 per gallon and will continue to go up for a long time. Only the very welthy will be able to afford the sport as we have enjoyed it for many years. I have seen very little done to improve the fiel consuption of the outboard engine. Many folks will give the sport up. Cut it way back or go back to the 14 ft 10 hp rigs that I grew up with. Those 14 ft boats work fine with one exception. They dont cover large distances in short periods of time. As the number of people that can afford our sport reduces so will the number of companies, research and enthusiasim that has surrounded the sport and made it grow. Notice how most of the guys that get rich as the sport grew in the 60's,70's.80's,90's have sold out and how the new owners are to some degree milking dollars.I am seeing more guys fishing less times per month. Luckily I live on the lake and dont have to pull.But some guys pull 75 or more miles one way to the lake.
Fish2win

[WTL]

Fish2win, I'm not concerned about that at all.

First, gas prices havent gone up as much as people think. The dollar is just buying less. Look at the price of milk, or hell flour has doubled in the past month. Clearly the big flour companies are trying to bilk us for all they can!

Second, as you said people are just going to smaller rigs. That is a good thing. You don't need a battleship to catch bass, and burning 40 gallons of gas on a few dinks is a waste.

Third, you have a theory that the number of people who enjoy fishing is going to decrease because of gas prices, but this theory does not take into account that other passtimes are similarly affected, if not more so. Nor does it really prove that fishing needs to continue to have sustained growth in the number of anglers. We honestly, probably need to cull some of the anglers we have now anyways.

[pignjig]

WTL, I'm not trying to hijack this thread so I'll understand if folks don't respond...

1. I wonder if the key to an active and growing angler population and increased energy resources might not be related to the availability and accessibility of quality fisheries? I'm not advocating this, just throwing it out. For instance, in the mountainous areas, we have quite a bit of land that is nothing more than hardscrabble farm, pasture or scrub forest. Why not build more hydro-electric dams that double as fisheries? What are the real pros and cons?

2. Regarding winnowing the takers from the givers in fishing- It seems a little spooky that, at least in VA, we need to take hunter safety classes in order to get a hunting license but no classes for a fishing license. I'm not in any way for big government at all, but why not require anglers to take classes? Not boating classes, but something along the lines of angling ethics?

I understand that some of the above raises the spectre of government involvement and regulation(again, I'm not advocating, just speculating). But, I believe that the anglers of this nation need to take a serious and honest look at the direction we're going. You mentioned that maybe there too many fishermen. Assume, subjectively, that you're correct. How does our sport get rid of the "excess"? How do we define excess?

Thanks again for an interesting thread!

-Pig

[torelaxandenjoy]

Just food for thought, there are many anglers out their that are not pros for various reason, but just maybe we could start real summer fishing camps and get the young'ns into this type of venue. They have sport camps for (jocks), they have summer studies for theatrics, IT camps for the Computer bound, and the list goes on. So I ask why not for fishing?