Who is ready for some football?

[bamabassman]

i agree wtl. i am STILL in denial. cautious cause we haven't "finished" a game YET.

[Lancer6]

Originally Posted by rodman_rob

i just gotta get outta prison first. 93 more months.

what??????

[flfireman]

Wow! Talk about some upsets on Saturday. I mean Thurs was great, not a big USC fan. But saturday was wild. Not gonna pick at anyone. Florida just did not seem motivated at all. Bad play calling also. 4th and 1, hmmmmm, no backs in back field. Who the hell else is gonna get the ball, come on Urban. The loss was a heartbreaker. I just hope they win out the season.

[Rodman_Rob]

Originally Posted by Lancer6

what??????

yeah, it was supposed to be 180 months originally, but I got a plea deal. They were gonna charge me with Barn yard sodomy, but after the plea the reduced the charge down to horseplay


Anytime I ain't fishing it feels like prison.

[bamabassman]

hahahahaha, rodman i think you got lancer6 REAL good there pal. that was a great one my friend. hahahahahahahahahahaha. just never grab a pig.........they'll squeel on ya.

[Lancer6]

It's becoming increasingly difficult for a team, ANY team, to reach the end of the season without a loss, or even two. You can thank the "parity" brought about by scholarship limitations in great part for that.
I sincerely wish that there was a viable playoff system for the "big guys" but politics and vested interests are likely to continue scotching that idea for decades to come. (Mmmmmm...Scotch!)
Of the "anti-playoff" arguments I find that which is based on "still more time away from the classroom" to be valid and, at the same time, somewhat spurious. I want the kids in class but the lesser echelons of college football have already taken the leap into playoff mode and I've seen NO empirical evidence whatsoever that would argue for them to end their post-season shootouts.
All that said, if there is to be a playoff system for the "Majors" there will be violent storms ahead once the selection process begins.
It's seems simple enough at first look; Conference champs are in...Check. The top indies are in...Check...and that may be where the excretia hits the fan.
You see, SOME conference champs may have records not particularly inspiring or impressive. You COULD lose, let's say, four non-conference tilts and maybe one conference game and still be in the mix re the playoffs.
But what of a conference runner-up that lost only ONE game the entire season? What if that team was in the same conference as the champ with those five losses I mentioned previously?...or not.
Now, let's say, just for illustration's sake, that the Big 12, the PACman 10, the big Ten-plus-one, the Essy Cee, the ACeeCee, the Big East, the WAC, all send their champs into the playoffs. That's seven. It follows that in order to start the ball rolling with four games you'll need one more team.
That's when the fun begins.
If among the indies there are no truly impressive season records do you still select one of them over a conference runner-up that is 10-1 and the sole setback was to either the conference champ who was 7-4 overall or maybe undefeated and ranked #1 at season's end?
I can guara-damn-tee yew that Our Lady of South Bend would likely SUE to get in even if they sported a record of 5-6 and one loss was to The University Of Southern North Dakota (At Hoople). The Eastern Establishment press would likely see to it that they DID get in, then pretend shock when the Sooners hung half-a-hunnert on 'em by halftime and suited up the flute section for the start of Half #2.
OK, so let's expand the playoff to start with sixteen teams. 'K?
Even though more deserving teams could then be included, there will still be sufficient whiners and weepers to cause chaos in the selection process. Remember Mack Brown throwing tantrums until the WrongWhorns got into a BCS bowl in lieu of the team originally (tentatively) selected?
OK, then, we'll go to thirty-two teams. What the Hell is this, NCAA Basketball?
At that level, starting with sixteen games, it'll take five weekends to get it all over with and crown a champion. That may not seem relevant to many but you can bet that the more academically minded will be heard from. And what about Christmas/Chanukah/Kwanzaa/and whatever-the-Hell-else?
Shoot, even the athiests, or at least the agnostics, might find fault with that.
Now, whaddya say to the "split" conferences that have their own C'ship game? The winner of that game will likely have no week off to lick wounds and prepare for the playoffs. If you DO grant a dead week, then the final game is pushed even farther into "next year". That, of course, leaves some teams with two weeks of R 'n R...nice for them, maybe.
There's no easy solution.
One solution MIGHT be to cut the regular season back to one wherein split conference teams play only ten games while those in more normal leagues play eleven. Still, even that creates inequity.
Luckily for us, we aren't the decision-makers. We just ***** about the system.

Lancer6

[WTL]

Lance, a playoff would kill college football. Destroy it. USC would have lost that other game, yeah if there was a playoff - they would shrug the loss off. Same for ohio state. Cause they would make the playoff which is all that matters.


The college football regular season is the only one I know of in sport where you really have to aim for perfection - and that coupled with the youthful age of the participants makes this into the greatest drama in sports.

Lets not continue the bastardization of this sport. It already resembles basketball on grass too much, what with the rule of 85 and the flag football offenses.

[Lancer6]

Please note, all readers, that I did NOT stump FOR a playoff system. I simply stated some of the pros and cons.
It's all too easy to be anti-playoff when your team is undefeated by this stage of the season and you hope/believe they will remain so. After all, one might think, "Look what the NFL playoff system did TO New England!" On the other hand, look what it did FOR the Giants. Like I said, pros and cons.
It's equally understandable that backers of a team that lost two regular season games but won their conference championship (we're talking college ball here) would want a plan in place whereby they might prove that those losses were flukes after all.
Here's a sure bet : If backers of OYou, Alabumble, Mizzou, Texiz, or any other currently unbeaten team suddenly find their guys with a blemish on their record a fair number of them will miraculously come to favor a playoff system in major college football.
When a season ends with multiple teams remaining undefeated there is only ONE means by which to truly and fairly determine the national champion and that, like it or not, is...A playoff.
The current "system", if one can call it that, is unfair, arbitrary, and too dependent on the sports media and "Style points". (See: Running the score up needlessly.)

L6

[cassidyta]

I for one am in favor of a playoff system. I think it should start with the top 6-8 teams. If you go 6, then there is a BYE. This is done in every other division of college football and I believe it works. I believe you can use a similar BCS style scoring system to establish the top teams. I believe you can even use a similar bowl system as your playoffs. We have too many anyways.
I think that is the only way you can pull it off because of the current sponsorship of the bowl games. I know many of us can remember when it was the sugar bowl and not the Nokia Sugar Bowl. The sponsors would throw fits if their bowls did not still have some meaning.
I can't buy off on using it as conference champs, because that is one of the flaws in the BCS. I don't think you should be in a BCS conference. I think Boise showed us that a couple of years ago. I think you should go with a similar BCS ranking system. Something that factors in record, strength of schedule, AP and coaches poll. A loss late in the season should have as much weight as an early one. The current system does not account for that.
Of course, their is more passion about College football than any other sport I know of. No system will make everyone happy, but I am in favor of playoffs.

[WTL]

Lance not only is that a stupid idea, considering that a playoff wouldnt be substituted mid season if Alabama were to lose, it ignores the fact that I have been passionately opposed to the idea of a playoff for several years.

Playoffs would kill the regular season. That is something I will never support, no matter how you package the deal.

[Lancer6]

Originally Posted by WTL

Lance not only is that a stupid idea, considering that a playoff wouldnt be substituted mid season if Alabama were to lose, it ignores the fact that I have been passionately opposed to the idea of a playoff for several years.

Playoffs would kill the regular season. That is something I will never support, no matter how you package the deal.

Lookie, young'un,

Again...I did NOT say I am in favor of a playoff system. It is, however, the only known way to determine a true champion. So far as the "stupid" usage goes, may I recommend a Dale Carnegie Course before you widen your audience beyond football and fishing forums?
As a matter of fact, if the NCAA ever does give a playoff system a trial run, you may be somewhat crestfallen to learn that your personal and passionate opposition has somehow been overlooked, sad to say. Don't feel too badly 'bout that. I doubt they'll call me for an opinion either.
I'll stand by my "suspicion" that supporters of a one or two-loss upper tier team would suddenly and vociferously support a playoff in order that their beloved Fighting Specimens could have a shot at a title.
For now, as ever and always, I'll root for my team. I will not let sour grapes cause me to root against any team ('cept mebbe Our Lady Of South Bend,) simply because they are a rival or team that has beaten us in FAIR competition.
If OU goes all the way...Great! If not, there's always next year...and the next...and the next, even if I'm no longer here to enjoy the games.
In the meanwhile, the PLAYERS should determine whom is "Champion", not media hacks and opposing coaches.

Next!

Lancer6
Note the "r".

[WTL]

It is a stupid idea old man, and I don't mind one bit telling you that. Every time people mess with the rules be it when the clock starts and stops, the new horsecollar rule, the rule of 85 or the BCS they screw something up.


Yes, there would be some fans who temporarily argue in favor of a playoff, but not me. Those fans would be as stupid as the idea of going to a playoff. We are stuck with the BCS till I believe 2012 by contract. Arguing for them to suspend the rules midseason, or arguing that their team has some moral claim to something because they would be dangerous in a hypothetical playoff is useless.

A playoff as I said would destroy the regular season. College football cannot, I repeat cannot have its Champion determined by a playoff system considering there are 117 teams. THAT IS THE DIFFERENCE. The NFL playoffs work cause because you have 30 something teams, which means there is always a more legitimate competition between each division. 117 is too big but the NCAA is still adding more just as they add more bowels, I mean bowls..

Let me remind you that should a playoff be enacted, the two conferences that would be hurt the most would be the ones with the toughest schedules - IE the SEC and Big12. Teams would be given incentive to avoid difficult schedules, showdown non conference games, they would even be given incentive to not go all out to win each and every game. The Champion of a hypothetical playoff system, then, would more often be a champion of avoiding that which makes college football great until perhaps the last 2 or 3 games of the year. THAT, SIR, IS NO TRUE CHAMPION OF ANYTHING BUT MAYBE A 3 GAME "SEASON". Miami, FSU, USC and the Ohio State U have already garnered too much praise from the practice of existing in weak conferences.

Of course in your ancient age and moribund intellectual condition I wouldn't expect you to realize this without someone giving you a clue, so there it is. You might not like the harshness of this post, but I don't appreciate being called young'un and rebuked for calling a spade a spade.

[Lancer6]

WTL (Witless Twerp, Literally)

I knew I'd set a hook in you. I did, however, think it might take a few more posts. I didn't set out to do that, of course. Instead, as I repeatedly stated, I wanted to raise the pros and cons, without seeking support for either side.
You chose to ignore that.
I wrote with little stabs at humor (See: Our Lady Of South Bend), though eschewing references to Bama Brand jams, jellies, and for all we know, pickled sow snouts, whereas you wrote with increasing rancor.
Insults: The final argument of the weak.

Now, be a good lad and go play with that nice man you take flower-arranging lessons from. Who knows? Perhaps he'll give you candy to enjoy during the afterglow.

"And as I end the refrain...Thrust home!"
Good Ol' Cyrano De. B.

Lancer6
You just can't fix "Stuck On Sophomore".

[WTL]

Lance, I think you are senile and I grow tired of reading posts from you that either try to be funny, witty or profound. Most of all I'm tired of trying to talk about football always knowing that you will come around with your same old crap. I'm not trying to make a joke out of this, I take football seriously and dont care to **** around with a bunch of garbage posts.

You are just pissed cause my team won big Saturday and you cant make fun of them anymore. You know it. Now go empty your diaper.

"And as I end the refrain...Thrust home!"
Good Ol' Cyrano De. B.

What the hells that even sposed to mean? This is a football thread on a friggin bass fishing board. I mean I'm really tired of your crap, it seems like every time I post something on football you come after me and your replies never make any damn sense. I didn't turn this personal, but I wont put up with your **** even if you are trying to get a rise.

[Lancer6]

Oh, one more thing; Who said anything suggesting that MORE than sixteen teams might form the playoff pack? Not me. Nope, never said it and those who actually read my posts in this thread will concur...at least the sober ones and those who aren't suffering from PMS will.

Lancer6
Laughing all the way.

[WTL]

You're the one trying to make a joke out of everything.

[Lancer6]

To the guys munching popcorn and watching this drama unfold:

Hmmmm. Search mightily didst I. Yet I could find not a whit of personal attack unleashed, while as yet unprovoked, by this scribe.
True, once were spat "Stupid", "Senile", "Moribund intellect", and like aspersions into the soup, I did respond (lightly at the outset, more pointedly as the brash bumpkin hissed more invective.)

About Good Ol' Cyrano. Here's a classic clip from a classic movie. Watch it in context of this thread's last few posts and you'll understand my "method" of dealing with insults.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bnsqrNdpJTw

That's the late great Jose Ferrer in the role. Watch the whole thing, gentle readers, and you'll get the meaning of "As I end...". If nothing else you'll see some amazing swordsmanship such as was common in the glory days of cinema. Errol Flynn, Douglas Fairbanks Jr., Jose Ferrer, and some others were truly deadly and could have held their own in mortal combat.

Cyrano was real, BTW.
From Wikipedia:

Hector Savinien de Cyrano de Bergerac (6 March 1619 – 28 July 1655) was a French dramatist and duelist who is now best remembered for the many works of fiction which have been woven around his life story. In these fictional works he is featured with an overly large nose; portraits suggest that he did have a big nose, though not nearly as large as described in Rostand's play and the subsequent works about him. There is a statue of him in Bergerac, Dordogne, the French market town.

Note to WTL...Stating a view not in accord with your own or expressing simple disagreement does not constitute nor justify a personal attack. You'll be better served in life if you grasp that concept.
Sadly, you apparently are unable to perceive or acknowledge that I have not clamored for a playoff system. Despite attempts to assure you of same you have screeched, ranted, and raved as though I have.
One's "Passion", if expressed and supported in the manner you've employed, may seem to observers as one which is best avoided.
It may come as a shock to you that someone else has a command of the language equal to or exceeding your own. Well, nut up, laddie, for we are legion in this world and most of us are "Old and senile". We've learned more, and more of how to both use and teach it, since we left the Halls Of Ivy.
Once evicted from the sheltering cloisters of Dear Old U. we followed a variety of paths. While we marched down different avenues, to different drummers, we all had the same opportunity to see the elephant firsthand in a manner for which no classroom could fully prepare us.
Some experiences were rather bland. Others, such as combat or the loss of loved ones, had a deeper effect. From these we gained strength even as we suffered and mourned. We toughened as we came close to death, saw good men die, and were compelled to slay others. From that last, some of us came to understand that the poor bastard wearing a different uniform was not an inherently bad creature. He was simply following his orders and perhaps doing so with the conviction that he was right in doing so. That explains why I bear you no hatred.
I may return fire in a veritable maelstrom of hot metal (We Iron Horse Cavalrymen do that kind of work; even those with Music degrees, like Lancer6.) but I will say a prayer for your soul and those you left back home, be it in Hanoi, Fallujah, or Mobile.
And...It may cause you distress when someone chooses to attempt to wrench a smile, snicker, or belly-laugh from a fairly serious discourse. As you mature you may come to understand that and, moreover, learn to contribute to, and enjoy, the game.
Lastly...You seem intent on launching insults based on my age. In response to that I offer the hope that when you are 65 you will harken back to this little tempest in a teapot and reassess your position. You will, I hope, find that, if anything, you've learned more than you know now. More importantly, you may well have learned the art of delivery.
May God grant you sufficient longevity to do so.

Lancer6
Without rancor. Without contempt

[WTL]

The young'un reference was extremely condescending considering I'm 25 and had to that point approached the discussion with considerable seriousness. I shouldn't have to put up with that **** on here.

[Lancer6]

The term "young'un" was used in the avuncular sense. After all, if I'm so old and senile as you stated you certainly are a young'un to me (and many others in your life.) Chances are, being a southerner, as am I, it won't be too many years before you employ the term on a regular basis.
That said, can you possibly earn some gladly-given respect by admitting in open forum that I did not proselyte for a playoff system? Careful rereading of my posts re that should make that possible. This time, don't let certain "key" words cheat you of a true understanding of my comments.
So far as jocularity, however successful or not so, in my posts is concerned, fathom this; Rare is the senile old coot who can even attempt humor. Add to that the fact that he is capable of doing so when life for the last few years has been one serving of lemons after the other. I can only drink so much lemonade...Acid reflux, y'know.
I do love poking fun, not viciously, at things which some regard as personal and sacrosanct icons; not with a view toward hurting feeling, but rather on order to teach that lesson that (seemingly) only senile old fools are qualified to natter about...Life's too short to take one's passions so seriously as to cause reactions and rifts when someone gooses your sacred cow.
I hasten to point out that I exempt certain passions from all but the most harmless barbs...One's religion and love for family, to name two. I might joke re priests predating on young boys but I'd never impugn the beliefs of faithful Catholics. I might call you a mama's boy in jest but I'd never cast the slightest aspersion on your mother.

The refrain is ended.

Lancer6

[WTL]

OK, I am gonna respond in a few sharp points;

#1. I NEVER said that you personally supported the idea of a playoff, but I did address my replies to you because you were playing devils advocate in favor of the idea. To that end, you need to pay more attention to other posts.

#2 You arent funny. Making inane references to errol flynn and God knows what else isn't humor. I didn't bring up lon chaney. Its not germane to the subject.

#3 I am from Alabama. I am familiar with southern vernacular. You said that you did not personally attack me, but like I said your replies were the ones that started this. And its not just this one time, every time I approach the subject of football you are waiting in the wings with some stupid reply. Enough is enough.

[Rodman_Rob]

This is what I LOVE about College Football! People are PASSIONATE about it. That's all I gotta say.

[doc]

You both claim to be southerners yet both of you use big ole words and refrence people with funny names. I think your imposters from france if you ask me.

viva la revolution, errol flynn, vernacular, Voulez-vous coucher avec moi

I told you guys I had david Beckham i new you were playing the across the pond fooseball, I knew it.

[Rodman_Rob]

ok, I'll say a little more. Prior to reading this thread, I've always been a fan of a playoff system. Although it wasn't until I read something WTL wrote that made me realize maybe I'm a little biased. I'm an OSU fan and the last few years, they've always been a powerhouse but have had at least 1 loss pretty much putting them out of contention of the #1 spot so it doesn't surprise me that I've wanted a playoff so that OSU would have a better shot. WTL said that the current system forces the teams to strive for perfection. I have to agree with this statement and am no longer in favor of a playoff system.

[Fishnngolfn]

Originally Posted by Rodman_Rob

ok, I'll say a little more. Prior to reading this thread, I've always been a fan of a playoff system. Although it wasn't until I read something WTL wrote that made me realize maybe I'm a little biased. I'm an OSU fan and the last few years, they've always been a powerhouse but have had at least 1 loss pretty much putting them out of contention of the #1 spot so it doesn't surprise me that I've wanted a playoff so that OSU would have a better shot. WTL said that the current system forces the teams to strive for perfection. I have to agree with this statement and am no longer in favor of a playoff system.

If one is to argue that the current setup forces a team to strive for perfection, then why do these so called powerhouses schedule "cupcakes" in their OOC schedule? If you are striving towards perfection, should you not want to play the best that is out there EVERY game and not just in your own conference?

The setup today forces teams to strive for perfection within their own conference. Teams feel that their conference schedule is strong enough to sufficiently rank them, so they do not strive for perfection outside of their conference. Most schools do schedule a few difficult opponents for the OOC schedule but most if not all strategically schedule a couple "cupcake-teams" essentially giving their team easy wins. Sure these cupcakes will pull an upset every now and then but you can't say with a straight face that the big win over Joe Schmo University had any influence over the ranking committee. All it does is pad their win column. You can argue that the team needs a rest, but isn't that what the bye weeks are for? Until teams try to fill their OOC schedule every week with the best teams out there, then the system today is flawed.


And yes I know UAB does the same thing, but I also have never argued that it was right. Beating Alabama State did nothing for us other than giving us a check in the win column. I would much rather lose to Tennessee, South Carolina, and similar OOC opponents than beat the snot out of St. Mary's Sisters of the Poor each week.

[WTL]

FishnGolf,

I think OOC scheduling depends on the team. An SEC team has a tough enough road already as does a Big12 team, 1 good OOC game is enough. A team like Ohio State though should play USC and try to schedule Miami or someone that can at least challenge them.

Also, there is a financial aspect to some of the weak OOC games. Most often if you play a good opponent, you have to do either a home and home, which means you play 2 games; 1 this year at your stadium and 1 the next at theirs. This means less revenue than if you had played 2 home games, 1 this year and 1 the next, against weak teams that dont have the clout for that. Its why Bama played Southern Miss so many years, they were a decent team, but we alwasy played at our house and pocketed our portion (%95) or so of the ticket revenue.