Muy Caliente

[mont_lunker_hunter]

This sounds about right.

http://rock103.com/pages/crew/twiste...refighters.wmv

[doc]

Well thats just wrong.

[JB]

on so many levels.....

[Fishnngolfn]

I heard that they are not the only fire station with that rule. I read somewhere that another station is paying for their head firefighters to take Spanish classes in order speak to the other firefighters.

I agree that it is a major safety issue. What is sad is that the state is unwilling to make both parties meet in the middle.

Can someone explain to me how it is considered discrimination to not hire someone because they can't speak English but it is not considered discrimination to fire someone who can't speak Spanish? I am confused by the "logic".

[doc]

Originally Posted by Fishnngolfn

I heard that they are not the only fire station with that rule. I read somewhere that another station is paying for their head firefighters to take Spanish classes in order speak to the other firefighters.

I agree that it is a major safety issue. What is sad is that the state is unwilling to make both parties meet in the middle.

Can someone explain to me how it is considered discrimination to not hire someone because they can't speak English but it is not considered discrimination to fire someone who can't speak Spanish? I am confused by the "logic".

Thats an easy one. Everyone can claim they are being discriminated aginst except. White, working, english speaking americans.

You see, apparently our ancestors (tho not mine, whom were as poor as dirt) messed things up so bad during slavery, that it forever exempted us from being discriminated aginst.

[bcklash]

hey mont lunter hunter it sounds like one " slip of the tongue" might outta be in spanish. This country is becoming crazy as HELL.

[mont_lunker_hunter]

si senior, muy loco

[Fishnngolfn]

Originally Posted by doc

Thats an easy one. Everyone can claim they are being discriminated aginst except. White, working, english speaking americans.

You see, apparently our ancestors (tho not mine, whom were as poor as dirt) messed things up so bad during slavery, that it forever exempted us from being discriminated aginst.

Alright, then what would an African American head firefighter claim when he is demoted or fired?

[doc]

Originally Posted by Fishnngolfn

Alright, then what would an African American head firefighter claim when he is demoted or fired?

The person in charge of personell at the Fire Dept would be fired, for hiring a conflict of discrimination.

[cassidyta]

Okay all, I know this will open up a can of worms, but here goes.

The Oregon law was first put into place in Oct of 2005 and it affects contract firefighting companies.
These are companies who control who they hire. Their staffing is approximatly 85% Hispanic and many do not speak English. The state did not lay off individuals, they would not renew the contracts of companies who did not adhere to this law.

The man who started this complaint is named Jaime Pickering, was terminated from training contract firefighters in 2004. In Jun of 2006, he went public with the complaints that made the news. He was not terminated for not speaking English, but rather because of some training and documnetation issues.

http://r-thinking.blogspot.com/2006/...-lafferty.html

[mont_lunker_hunter]

party pooper

[cassidyta]

Sorry Mont, I will try not to allow facts to get in the way of a stirring debate....LOL

[Fishnngolfn]

Originally Posted by cassidyta

Sorry Mont, I will try not to allow facts to get in the way of a stirring debate....LOL

Actually, I appreciate the facts. I know the media and other sources of info are often one sided and try to stir things up.

[Lilmoosecountry]

Why is the state hirring people who can't speak english. Thatz the way i see it fire the them spanish speaking folks. Wecome to the USA now speak english or your not entitled to anything that includes jobs.

[Lilmoosecountry]

Originally Posted by doc

Thats an easy one. Everyone can claim they are being discriminated aginst except. White, working, english speaking americans.

You see, apparently our ancestors (tho not mine, whom were as poor as dirt) messed things up so bad during slavery, that it forever exempted us from being discriminated aginst.

Yep your darn toot'n. If white folks say the same as other minoritys then were deemed racist. I never used to be but with double standards that go on in this country. I'm starting to think that way.

[mont_lunker_hunter]

cassidy, i was just joking, i'm sure you know that. Like Doc said, it's seems like we (white men) are more and more finding ourselves discriminated against by those who are trying not to discriminate against others. Hate to bring this up, but the recent election is a prime example. Like I've said before...some "minorities" use racism to justify laziness and lack of self motivation. It's easy to blame your problems on others and let others take the rap for your economic or housing problems. Meanwhile, those who work 40+ hours a week are finding themselves discriminated against from all angles. I live in south Arkansas. At any given time during the day you can ride through minority populated areas and see able bodied 20-30 year olds walking around or standing around with their "pits" while waiting on their gov't check. I'll bet anything that they'll claim they are discriminated against. I bet their thinking, "There goes Whitey, I sho hope he keeps working so I don't have to. Bring me some mo chicken wings Boo...and a Fotee".

That all reminds me of a picture i seen once...I read like this:

For a good time call Shameeka at fi fi fo - fo fi tree ni

[cassidyta]

Mont, I knew it was a joke, so no worries.

The point that I wanted to make when this came up was simple. The state did not lay this guy off because he did not speak Spanish. He was never a state employee, he was simply working a contract.
I know the biggest question/statement on this is "Then why did the company hire so many non English speaking employees" (85%) There are only two possible reasons for this.
1) They were able to hire them at a lower rate.
2) They were the ones who applied for the job.

One other note, I have come to learn that laziness and a lack of work ethic is not specific to any particular economic, ethnic, or cultural background. I believe that if I go to any location that has a similar group of people. (white, black, asian, or any other) That I will see individuals of that culture who exhibit laziness and I sense of "someone owes me something"

I believe this is even getting worse in your middle class predominantly white locations.

Hell, there is no reason to limit the number of little league teams, make more teams so no one gets their feelings hurt because they were not good enough.

Forget holding kids accountable to academic standards; lower the standards so that “No child is left behind”

Your child is not misbehaving, they are expressing themselves. It is not that they are not listening the issue is that they have some sort of disorder that restricts their ability to pay attention.

[mont_lunker_hunter]

One other note, I have come to learn that laziness and a lack of work ethic is not specific to any particular economic, ethnic, or cultural background. I believe that if I go to any location that has a similar group of people. (white, black, asian, or any other) That I will see individuals of that culture who exhibit laziness and I sense of "someone owes me something"

I agree with your post except for the above quote. My answer to that is simple, move to south arkansas. I think we'd be on the same page then.

[mont_lunker_hunter]

Also, let me say that I know there are whites that use excuses too, but they don't blame another race of people...that's my point. Again, that's around here, I'm sure things may change with demographics.

[doc]

Originally Posted by mont_lunker_hunter

I live in south Arkansas. At any given time during the day you can ride through minority populated areas and see able bodied 20-30 year olds walking around or standing around with their "pits" while waiting on their gov't check.

Whom happen to be the same people in the "arrest report" in the local newspaper. Just to be clear, I have no problem with anyones ethnic background, I just see no excuses in todays world to not be a productive member of society.


I also truely believe that the white working man is the most discriminated aginst person in America Today. We are picked last for jobs even if we are the most qualified, you have to watch what you say or face social anniliation, yet If someone of any other background says the same thing it's ok. I'll use don imus and reverand white as 2 examples. Imus said "nappy headed hoes", was fired and will be lucky to eek out a career without being shot in his sleep one night. Reverand white says "the U.S. of KKK, G, D, America, etc..... preached that **** for years, It only became an issue in the Election, And you still couldn't attack Obama face on with it without YOU being called a racist.

[doc]

Originally Posted by mont_lunker_hunter

I agree with your post except for the above quote. My answer to that is simple, move to south arkansas. I think we'd be on the same page then.

Agreed. It really is that bad here

[cassidyta]

Originally Posted by mont_lunker_hunter

Also, let me say that I know there are whites that use excuses too, but they don't blame another race of people...that's my point.

I doubt they blame it as much on history, but there are ones who will say that they can not get a job due to affirmative action and the company had to hire a black, or that the illegals are taking all of the jobs.

I was sued last year by a white guy when I did not hire him for a systems administrator position. He claimed that I had chosen a black woman over him simply to fill a quota. Fortunately for me I was able to produce copies of the two resumes and my interview notes.

I won't deny that the black race has been the one who has been the most vocal in the terms of discrimination.

[doc]

Illegals taking american jobs is wrong I dont care what color they are.

There are people who say that jobs are hard to come by due to affirmative action, and there is truth to that.

[cassidyta]

Doc, I agree 100% with both of your statements.
Living in Southern Cali as I do, I can see the Illegal part daily. Unfortunately, there are too many able bodied citizens who feel that they are above picking avocados or any other manual labor.
Who knows, maybe the current economic conditions will drive our citizens to these jobs.

[mont_lunker_hunter]

Cassidy, Doc is right. Here in south Arkansas, things are obviously different from where you are.

I doubt they blame it as much on history, but there are ones who will say that they can not get a job due to affirmative action and the company had to hire a black, or that the illegals are taking all of the jobs.

They do blame history...that's the problem! Do you think it's right that my taxes go to support a great great great grandson of a slave who has probably never held a job and probably will never have to? I sure as heck don't. As far as getting passed up for jobs...again...come to south arkansas. It seems like you're suggesting something like "come on it's not that bad". Well, maybe not there, but it is here. That's all i'm saying. I've repeatedly said "south arkansas", I can not speak for any other region.