How to get bigger bass?

[PondBassin]

Hey guys,
I'm new to this site, so if this thread or anything like it has been done before, I'm sorry.
But anyway, here's my dilemma. I have a pond in my backyard that was stocked by the previous owners with bass, various sunfish, some channel cats, and some mosquito fish (a sort of baitfish for the pond). The problem I'm having is this; the bass in the pond are very small. They have been in the pond for about ten years now ( I've fished the pond for 5 years) and I have seen very few bass exceeding the 4 pound range. The previous owner told me to expect this. The pond is pretty small, and I believe there is a sufficent amount of food in the pond. I also know for a fact that the pond is not overpopulated. The fish are never taken out of the pond and are always released back. They are all northerns, no Florida's or mixes. What I was hoping to find on this site was a way to beef up the size of the bass? I'm not sure if this can be done, as we don't want to restock the pond at all. Should we try and add a species (although I'm afraid this would set off the food chain)? Is there a sort of bass feed that the bass would eat to bulk up? Any answer would be helpful.
Thanks!
PB

[WaffleJaw]

If the bass are never culled,How do you know its not over populated?
How's the forage?.What are they eating?..Are the bass your catching similar in size/skinny?..Typically when you have crowding issues in a small pond,they run through their food source pretty rapidly...Which in return wont allow the medium size bass to grow larger due to a lack of sufficient food source...

[bassboogieman]

Feed them KIT KAT bars. http://www.fieldandstream.com/blogs/...t-kat-bar-diet

[keithdog]

Originally Posted by WaffleJaw

If the bass are never culled,How do you know its not over populated?
How's the forage?.What are they eating?..Are the bass your catching similar in size/skinny?..Typically when you have crowding issues in a small pond,they run through their food source pretty rapidly...Which in return wont allow the medium size bass to grow larger due to a lack of sufficient food source...

I have to agree with Waffle on this, especially in a small pond. It's essential that "some culling" take place.

[PondBassin]

I did cull The pond for about a month last year. I ended up removing about 30 bass smaller than 14 inches. I'm sure that isn't the problem.

[Fish30114]

Well I'd sure be curious as to why you are sure that isn't the problem, because that and the attendant inadequate food supply for the larger bass in the pond would be the top two reasons for a low ceiling in maximum size for the dominant fish species in the pond.

Without shocking the pond, doing several surveys and a water analysis it is tough to say, but some more details such as water depth, temperatures, supply and turnover of water in the pond, amount of cover/structure, might help. I have experience in managing MANY ponds/lakes in the state of Georgia, I've built nearly 100. It is a STRONG possibility that there are too many midsized bass in this pond, which eliminate baitsized fish for all of the bass population--and these baitfish include baby bass. One other possibility that can devastate bass populations (second only to catfish populations) is the presence of 2 or more freshwater otters. These rascals can decimate a pond, and they target larger fish first. Knowing the size of the pond would help understand some of the challenges you may face. Wafflejaw's questions are right on point, let us know a little more and maybe we can give some more useful input.

[keithdog]

By the way PondBassin, welcome to the forums!!! I know you'll find this on line community to be a very helpful and friendly place to be. Glad to have ya aboard.

[PondBassin]

Alright thanks for the suggestions guys. Is there any type of fish food that you could throw into the pond that would help bulk up the fish (specifically the bass)?

[Bubba_Bruiser]

PB, I sent you a pamplet to your provided address from your profile from the MS Game & Fish on pnd management. Maybe it can give you a little insight.

[Fish30114]

PB, there are in fact several supplemental food sources that will gelp bass gain size, but the real key is to have an appropriate 'spread' of fish in the water system. Believe it or not there is straight up Purina Fish Chow!! That alone would be slow to show results on higher max sized bass though....

Feeder fish of various types are available, but they are not cheap. I coordinated over 50,000 feeder trout being introduced into several different lakes here in GA in this spring and last, these have the most direct impact on fish size of any supplemental feeding I have seen. Utilizing 3/4" size or larger feeder trout help minimize the amount taken by fish under a certain size---thereby helping your larger bass more than the smaller ones.

Without getting too technical, all bass vary in their quality. It is typical to look at bass as a certain % of a predetermined 100% quality. Said simply, you can have a 100% fish, which represents ideal proportions, that is 18" long, and weighs say 3-3 1/2 lbs. This fish would have girth in proportion to it's length (say 14"-15"), and shape that is appropriate for it's sex. (male LM are longer and more slender from top to bottom, and weigh less than females). In a less ideal environment, a same length bass (which is also likely older) could be a 70% fish, and in that example would weigh say 2lbs and a couple ounces. This fish would be more slender in overall profile, and especially look 'skinny' when viewed from the top. The bottom line being, if you know the quality of your fish at various sizes, you can manage much better. It is VERY likely that you need to cull WAY MORE fish than you would probably guess to bring your pond into balance. Many other variables as I mentioned before also come into play.

But heck, if you just wanna feed em some to see what happens, go to a feed store, they should have a few selections of dry fish feed available, and buy a feeder that throws feed out at typical feeding peeks, say 15 mins after sunrise, and 30 mins before sunset. Be aware the the main beneficiaries of this type of feeding are your smaller fish and bottom feeders like catfish, but it's still fun, and you can augment your catfish size quite effectively with this method. Good luck to you, if you supply some more details I'd be glad to try and shed some more light for you.

[mrmuskie5]

Do the bass have any visual defects? snubbed face, small tails, short but fat, long but skinny? these can be signs of over population or low quality breeding stock. if in fact it is over populated start cutting some heads off for dinner lol. Im no biologist but i have done a small amount of reserch on theis subject because my buddy bought some property last year with a small pond on it and every bass we caught was a cookie cutter of the last, not to mention you could catch 2 fish on a single ripbait on multiple casts.lol

[AUFred]

Certainly sounds like overpopulation to me. How do the bream look? Are they thin or fat? Too many catfish can also stunt your bass population. Most ponds you could remove every bream and catfush caught and it would improve your bass population. You could check with a local conservation department but my guess is you need to remove way more bass than you have in the past.

[PAfisher76]

You should call your local fish commision and talk to a biologist.They would know the best coarse of action.

[Bassboss]

Yeah, it sounds like it's over populated. Try keeping a few small ones every time ya go out for a month or so. The small ones eat food the big ones could eat, letting the big ones get bigger, the smaller ones you don't catch eat more = grow bigger. You could try putting craws in there too lots of nutrients in em good for growing bucket months.

Then their's always the possibility that the pond just dose not have what it takes to produce fish. Any good spawning areas? Or is the lake deep through out with no shallow areas (a steep bank). Do you keep the pond "clean" by taking any and all "ugly" () looking weeds out? They need stuff to hide in and ambush pray.

I would also suggest contacting a DNR feller. You might get someone to come out and take a look too, you'd probably be able to give an accurate "diagnosis."

[Top Tiger]

What size is the pond? Is it natural or man made? Where I used to live, there was a "pond", but it was almost 10 acres. I've also seen ponds that are only 30yds in diameter. What is the natural forage? A lot of stuff to know and study on before you start changing things. Small fish are better than no fish.

[bamabassman]

your local conservation office can measure your pond and tell you jsut how many POUNDS of fish to harvest each year. and they can tell you how to manage it properly too. they can give oyu all the information you need to make it a hawg mollie fisherie.

[Fish30114]

Originally Posted by bamabassman

your local conservation office can measure your pond and tell you jsut how many POUNDS of fish to harvest each year. and they can tell you how to manage it properly too. they can give oyu all the information you need to make it a hawg mollie fisherie.

Well,--not so much in Ga Bama...unfortunately they never did consistently do that, just here and there so to speak, but no longer. The state DNR is a better resource, in fact you CAN get some free fish from them to stock a lake ocassionally--but it takes some good timing/luck to do so....most people serious about lake/pond management hire a specific firm to do so.

Understanding a lot of the basics is really the key, size of water body--e.g. dimensions including depth, obviously a bathometric survey is best, but knowing approximate depths, surface area, variances in water level, and therefore depth, water supply, amount of structure/cover etc. can help a lot, but.....it is difficult to really know what you actually have fishwise in your water system without a fish survey being done. PH, and non-typical impacts can be key to managing your 'pond' well. Presence of fresh water otters as I mentioned previously WILL have a major impact on a 'pond' or a lake under several hundred acres as well.

I have worked on a lot of ponds that border what I would call a lake, the difference being total size in surface area, but heck a lot of people call anything form a 1/10th acre (4,350 sq. ft.) to something up to 50 acres a pond,, but that is not what distinguishes one from the other--in fact ALL lakes and ponds in Georgia are manmade--yep, ALL of them....so it's quite a science actually, but generally, the accepted distinction revolves around water flow, depth and type of water in the body.

Ponds are shallower to the extent that they allow sunlight to get to the bottom of the entire body of water, and thereby allow plant growth on the entire bottom of the pond, whereas a lake is deep enough that light does not penetrate to the bottom sufficiently to allow plant growth. Another generally accepted distinction is that lakes will also have LOTIC water (water that flows in a definite direction) and ponds will have LENTIC water (no continual flow). Ponds also tend to evolve over time moreso than a lake typically, and the evolution would go from lake to pond to wetland--sediment and altered water flow changing the physical conditions of the body of water.

Sorry for the rant, but suffice all that to say, that the PH of a POND, especailly a smaller one can be another key factor in impcating fish size!

[bamabassman]

not offended at all fish. i know alabama conservation will help oyu out. but now that oyu wrote this about georgia, very enlightening, i guess he should find a firm to help him out.

[Fish30114]

Glad no offense taken Bama, I guess the gov ebbs and flows on what they'll do based on their mood, AND where you are!! HA

If 'PondBassin' leaves a little more intel, I'll do my best to point him in a direction, and heck doing a survey costs some, and I'd be trying to do it as cheap as possible myself!

[Top Tiger]

Let me get this right: There are no natural lakes in Georgia? I didn't know that. Really?

[Jrob78]

Originally Posted by Top Tiger

Let me get this right: There are no natural lakes in Georgia? I didn't know that. Really?

That's not surprising, there's only 1 in Texas.

[lilmule]

Actually you can take a goldfish thats feed well adult and place in alarger contaner and it will grow,place again in an even larger contaner and it will grow again to some extent.
There fore you wont get ten pders in a small pond regardless of food available.
Enlarge the pond or be satified with a few 4 lbers.
A one acre pond can support about 200 bass none of which get huge,reduce that to 50 and one gets some nice ones<but not wall hangers yet.
At some point or time size of impoundment means nothing or very little.So the size theory realitive to impoundment is limited to limited space,10 gal aq versus 20 versus 90 versus 1/3 acre versus something of an acre,afterward its not an issue.
But if you dont believe me release a goldfish youve had for years into a larger bit of water.

[Bassboss]

Originally Posted by lilmule

Actually you can take a goldfish thats feed well adult and place in alarger contaner and it will grow,place again in an even larger contaner and it will grow again to some extent.
There fore you wont get ten pders in a small pond regardless of food available.
Enlarge the pond or be satified with a few 4 lbers.
A one acre pond can support about 200 bass none of which get huge,reduce that to 50 and one gets some nice ones<but not wall hangers yet.
At some point or time size of impoundment means nothing or very little.So the size theory realitive to impoundment is limited to limited space,10 gal aq versus 20 versus 90 versus 1/3 acre versus something of an acre,afterward its not an issue.
But if you dont believe me release a goldfish youve had for years into a larger bit of water.

Bass are not gold fish....

When I was little I had an Oscar in a 50gal tank, we eventually had to get rid of it because it got to the point where it could barely move around in the tank.

But then again... bass are not Oscar either!

[Ebbetsguy]

Contact BOB LUSK, Pond Management, many consider him the best in the business

here is a link to get to his site;
http://www.texomahatchery.com/about/bob-lusk

[Bassman96]

Originally Posted by keithdog

By the way PondBassin, welcome to the forums!!! I know you'll find this on line community to be a very helpful and friendly place to be. Glad to have ya aboard.

X2!!! Its addicting after a while!